Ipsos provided the one new poll for the week in its monthly outing for the Fairfax papers, and it raised a few eyebrows with its weak primary vote for Labor and extraordinarily strong result for the Greens, the latter exacerbating a long established peculiarity of this pollster. The poll’s addition to the BludgerTrack aggregate takes a certain amount of edge off the recent blowout to Labor, while still finding them on course for a victory of historic dimensions. The BludgerTrack seat projection has Labor down three on last week’s result, with Victoria, Queensland and Western Australia each moving one seat in the Coalition’s favour. The methodological caveats about BludgerTrack from last week’s post continue to apply, as does the fact that I won’t be updating the leadership ratings until the model has a solid enough base of Morrison-era data to work from. Other than that, full results from the link below.
adrian
Or late at night.
guytaur @ #70 Thursday, September 20th, 2018 – 8:49 am
Guytaur
I am prepared to argue ISIS members should be able to speak on campus. The ONLY rules I would impose is that they are not allowed to incite violence of any kind. I would be very strict on that. But if ISISwished to put its case for why there should be a Caliphate and even Sharia law then they should have that right.
Now before you ask I loathe with every bone in my body both those ideas and should Sharia law becoming to Australia I might find a pea shooter or learn how to be a guerrilla fighter.
However the right to free speech especially at Universities is sacrosanct. Once you shut down ISIS for free speech then you have lost the moral high ground. Totalitarians have won. There are no if or but. No get outs.
Of course perhaps what we need is a return to the old soap box as in the Sydney Domain.
Every sort of nutter should be able to get on their soap box on a Sunday morning and sprout their ideas. Parks around the country should actively encourage this activity. Great for community involvement, great for free speech and also quite fun to watch.
The ABC should also provide such a free speech forum – for every nutter. Perhaps it could first be on a queue system – so every ranter gets a turn – perhaps the earliest morning slot. Say 6 am. 10 each week on a first come first served basis. (maybe it could be state based). To progress to the to the 7 am slot you need 20 or 50 likes. To get to 8 am you need 1000 likes. You could perhaps organise it so that one week the speakers get to rant about the environment, another week about housing etc.
It would sort of be like PB on TV -or a radio spot for those who which to hide their faces.
Stanmore, thats right. Lovely area.
DTT
Unlike you I favour the same standard as we give Nazism with ISIS.
If students want to protest a speaker at University thats their right.
DaretoTread
I am prepared to argue ISIS members should be able to speak on campus. The ONLY rules I would impose is that they are not allowed to incite violence of any kind. I would be very strict on that. But if ISISwished to put its case for why there should be a Caliphate and even Sharia law then they should have that right.
_______________________________
Wouldn’t the police arrest any self declared ISIS member as soon as they put their hand up? I mean they are a proscribed terrorist group here.
DTT
I am with ACLU in the US on protest. Dissent is patriotic.
A local lad has just jetted off to one of them on an internship thingo. Its his second trip. He raves about the density of these galleries and workshops and the resulting hotbed of creativity… and the gravity it produces in pulling guys like him and others from all corners.
News from the Frontline.
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/live/2018/sep/20/morrison-shorten-dutton-coalition-labor-greens
Berry Force, now recruiting.
Reported in the Guardian:
[‘The Senate passed a motion yesterday demanding the government produce the Ruddock religious freedom report. Late yesterday, the government responded with the Senate version of “yeah, nah” by saying it was confidential. Which it is. Right until after the Wentworth byelection is over.’]
Ruddock’s report must be a crock lest it would be released before the by-election. How can such a report be given confidential status? The Morrison Government is too sneaky by half.
Like most big cities, in Sydney local knowledge goes a long way. If I’m around ‘fess, I’d be delighted to be of any assistance. We’re based in the inner east when I’m in town, a few days a week at least. I’ve emailed Mr Bowe to give you my email if you want. (I gather Mum is in Wentworth, iirc, so there’s common ground.)
If not using Opal and public transport, we use Uber (heaps of them abound) a lot for short trips where parking at the end is a problem or expensive, the norm in the CBD, from parking stations to meters.
The primary reason for the censure of Dutton is that he misled Parliament.
The question Dutton answered was as follows:
“Can you categorically rule out any personal connection or any other relationship between you and the intended employer of either of the au pairs?”
Dutton’s reply “The answer is yes.
It is now undisputed that there was some sort of “personal connection or any other relationship” between Dutton and the intended employers of both au pairs. By his answer Dutton wanted to hide the fact that he had intervened in an arbitrary and unprincipled act of Ministerial discretion.
Under the Constitution Ministers, who are the heads of the executive arm of Government, are appointed exclusively from Parliament – the body of democratically elected representatives that constitute the legislative arm of Government. By this mechanism we the people are able through our representatives to exercise control over Executive Government (subject to Yes Minister considerations).
So when a Minister answers a question in Parliament it is vital to the Constitutional relationships that the Minister not mislead. Parliament should not be given the mushroom treatment, ever. Sometimes a Minister innocently misleads Parliament (information provided to the Minister might have been inaccurate). However innocuous the Minister should inform Parliament at the earliest occasion and explain how the error arose.
In this instance Dutton misled Parliament deliberately. He sought to hide embarrassing details that reveal his misuse of Ministerial discretion for personal advantage.
The faith Parliament is entitled to have in Dutton as a Minister is thereby destroyed. Since Parliamentary faith is the Constitutional basis for Dutton being appointed a Minister, he should preferably and in accordance with precedent resign or otherwise be dismissed.
guytaur says:
Thursday, September 20, 2018 at 10:19 am
briefly
Thus argue discrimination not free speech.
If you argue free speech you are in fact arguing that ISIS preachers and Nazis are free to speak at events without protest too.
There are skinheads and trolls – those who would exploit the civil space in order to deprive us of that space. We have to figure out how to preserve the civil space and the exercise of our freedoms while also responding to the skinheads and trolls.
Political exchange, campaigning and commentary/reporting frequently turns out to be not much more than trolling and provocation. It’s no wonder people have lost trust in politics and refrain from participating in it.
We have our share of trolls here. Very large parts of the MSM and social media consist of nothing but trolling.
“The faith Parliament is entitled to have in Dutton as a Minister is thereby destroyed. Since Parliamentary faith is the Constitutional basis for Dutton being appointed a Minister, he should preferably and in accordance with precedent resign or otherwise be dismissed.”
And that would be on the front page of The Australian if it were a Minister in a Labor Government. The front page of the Telecrap would be taken up with a cartoon or photoshopped picture of the Minister with his pants on fire and a long nose.
Confessions @ #78 Thursday, September 20th, 2018 – 9:01 am
Simply wrong. Cost will be $2.70 for an adult. $2.50 all day for everywhere if you are a pensioner.
re central/Redfern fare
https://transportnsw.info/trip#/?wSpeed=4&wDuration=20&itMode=walk&routeFilter=time&train&bus&ferry&lightRail&coach&schoolBus=false&accessible=false&arrDep=dep&opalOnly=false&from=10101100&to=10101421
briefly
As I just said to DTT. Dissent is Patriotic.
The power lies with the Uni administration. The students have a right to voice their objections.
See the cartoon AR posted.
Edit: That means if the powerful listen to the dissenters thats a good thing
briefly, “We have to figure out how to preserve the civil space and the exercise of our freedoms while also responding to the skinheads and trolls.”
Unfortunately I have to go out now, but you’ve touched on a point I would welcome a discussion on. Perhaps I can revisit later tonight?
In any case, perhaps a place to start is by identifying “civil space”. What is it? Then we can think about how can it can be maintained?
Yabba @ #164 Thursday, September 20th, 2018 – 10:50 am
Opal for interstate seniors:
https://www.opal.com.au/en/about-opal/opal_for_interstate_seniors/
I recall the speakers’ corner in the Domain. There was everyone from end of the world crackpots, more mainstream religious preachers, communists, advocates of free love, conspiracy theorists and people with weird ideas about race. The same people would now be internet bloggers or callers to talkback radio.
I think if we still had speakers’ corner today, it would quickly be taken over by climate deniers, tobacco lobbyists and gun lobbyists funded by vested interests.
The increased penalty from ten to fifteen years for messing with food is a joke. Since when do strong penalties serve as either a general or personal deterrent? A person high on ice, for instance, doesn’t think of the consequences when knocking off the corner store. Punishment does fit the other elements of the sentencing process, but deterrence is rarely one of them – at least in my experience.
Re Opal for seniors, you don’t have to be a pensioner, you don’t have to even be senior, just old, or at least with your 60th birthday retreating in the rear view mirror.
Aunt Mavis.
The government is doing overreach to grab political momentum.
Thats it. Deterrence works to an extent. Its why we have jails. However it doesn’t work all the time as Duetre has proved with his war on drugs in the Philippines. Despite all the mass murder there are still drugs and addicts there.
The deterrent is the probability of getting caught, not the severity of the sentence. Increasing the sentence for food-tampering to 15 years is nothing but grandstanding.
nath @ #155 Thursday, September 20th, 2018 – 10:28 am
Well it was the same with the anti conscription guys in the 1960s. They went onto campus but were protected from the police. So yes as a proscribed group they may not choose to risk it. But that would be their choces
When I went to University the Police were NOT welcome on campus. it was one of those free speech things. How things have degenerated.
We have too many trolls.
Tony Abbott was possibly the first full-time troll we’ve had who made it all the way to the top. The Gs are basically a trolling outfit, as is ON. Dutton is a troll. Anning is a skinhead (in more ways than one). Bolt is a skinhead, as is Bannon. Trump of course is the super troll.
Thanks Itza! We aren’t going to be there until just before christmas so I understand it will be a busy time. We won’t stay with mum because I don’t want to cramp her comings and goings so are staying in the CBD.
Most of my family that we’ll be catching up with is in the Chatswood-Forestville area hence the need for a car, although as a kid staying with my grandparents we always caught the train into the city. I’ve never, ever used an Uber before so that would be something new.
“Increasing the sentence for food-tampering to 15 years is nothing but grandstanding.”
True, but with the amendments Dreyfus proposed largely harmless. Do it, move on to real stuff like making Potato Chips today. 🙂
If you require needles, you better go to Spotlight:
https://www.smh.com.au/national/sewing-needles-removed-from-woolies-shelves-amid-strawberry-scare-20180920-p504ve.html
Seems to be a little over the top, but I guess this is coming from insurers.
DaretoTread @ #176 Thursday, September 20th, 2018 – 8:02 am
My understanding is that State police need a warrant , but the feds don’t. 🙂
I want to know who the idiot was who invented the words ‘prescribed’ (compulsory) and ‘proscribed’ (forbidden). Were they deliberately trying to be confusing?
Thanks Yabba, but I am not a senior. I am just going off what I’ve found on the NSW Transport website:
https://transportnsw.info/tickets-opal/opal/fares-payments/opal-single-tickets
Aunt Mavis.
Hysteria has gripped the nation. Just as the LNP want it. Be afraid be very afraid.
Late Riser
I have to go to work in a minute too. It’s a discussion we have to have… “Stop the Trolls”…
🙂
Talking of fried Potato, here’s a snippet from Amy! 🙂
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/live/2018/sep/20/morrison-shorten-dutton-coalition-labor-greens
guytaur @ #154 Thursday, September 20th, 2018 – 10:27 am
Guytaur
I have no problem with students protesting a speaker. None at all. I encourage it.
The real question I suppose is whether the students protest so loudly that the speaker cannot be heard. No I do not agree with that. Because for obvious reasons if the ALP was speaking on campus on say euthanasia, it would not be acceptable for the very active christian types to heckle and protest so loudly they cannot be heard.
Look if you do not like someones arguments then develop an intelligent retort. Shouting is not that. There is ALWAYS something to be learned by listening to opponents even the most extreme. it is a fool of a student who yells so hard they do not hear the message. after all how can you reply if you have no idea what they are saying.
No ifs no buts – free speech is an essential – PARTICULARLY for those whom you most despise.
Cue debate on ‘old’. We have a provocateur. Over 60, old is ten years older than you. At least. And at least till you can’t count.
guytaur says:
Thursday, September 20, 2018 at 10:52 am
briefly
As I just said to DTT. Dissent is Patriotic.
Unless you’re willing to defend Arndt’s right to dissent from the Vice-Chancellors, this is an utterly meaningless gesture….which is exactly what we might expect from our local troll, dtt.
I reckon that the person who originally put a needle in a strawberry might have left the country already.
DTT
This is the point. The students in the Arndt case have exercised their free speech. The powerful have listened to them. The students dissent have been heard.
Thats democracy. Its not discrimination as the majority the powerful represent listened to the dissenters.
Steve777 @ #169 Thursday, September 20th, 2018 – 10:55 am
Steve
So what!
There would be all sorts of weird religious types, anti vaxers, but also new and emerging parties could be there.
The thing is WE are bloggers. All those people who call on radio are real people they VOTE.They have as much right to a platform as Scott Morrison or any bloody parson or priest.
it was a kid. so NO. Depending on the age he has probably been grounded for a few weeks and lost the use of his Xbox.
Anna Chau is a well respected economist at Infrastructure Australia, but she is dead wrong about this argument for not lowering (to 4%) Australia’s absurdly high discount rates (7%) used to assess transport investments. The problem has nothing to do with making unviable projects viable. The current system encourages far too much short term thinking, that ignores long term costs. Labor should support the changes proposed.
https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/infrastructure-australia-chief-blasts-plan-to-make-dud-projects-easier-to-justify-20180918-p504ea.html
Chatswood is well served by rail. You would be unlucky to wait 10 minutes for a train to the City. It also serves as a local hub for bus services, some of which go past Forestville. You could plan trips using this link: https://transportnsw.info/trip#/?wSpeed=4&wDuration=20&itMode=walk&routeFilter=time&train&bus&ferry&lightRail&coach&schoolBus=false&accessible=false&arrDep=dep&opalOnly=false&from=poiID:8117:95362004:-1:Chatswood%20RSL%20Club:Chatswood:Chatswood%20RSL%20Club:ANY:POI:4887026:3747545:GDAV:nsw&to=suburbID:95360012:1:Forestville:4890556:3743773:GDAV
Barney in Go Dau @ #179 Thursday, September 20th, 2018 – 11:05 am
That’s my recollection too BiGD. No cops allowed in our day anyway.
“Woman attacked by shark on holiday.”
Do they ever read what they’ve written?
guytaur @ #189 Thursday, September 20th, 2018 – 11:11 am
Guytaur
To be honest I have not been following the particular of the Arndt case. My point would be that if she is invited to speak by any official Uni group – club society etc then she should be heard in reasonable silence – clever heckling encouraged. Students have a right to protest long and hard about her MESSAGE but not here right to be heard
So ScumMo likes to have misleading minsters. I wonder why?
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-09-20/morrison-rejects-calls-to-sack-dutton-over-au-pair-saga/10284690
Has ScumMo asked Dutton for any Visa favors?
Daretotread, what if, as part of their advocacy for sharia law, those isis members argue the case for why gays should be executed – is that not inciting violence?
Also, speaking about someone high on Ice, and I mean it metaphorically, but did you catch the performance from Morrison on Today this morning? Back to speaking at a million miles an hour and sounding like a State government leader: “We’re all about stopping the boats, the criminals and the bikie gangs!! ”
What a plonker!
This will fix the drought. (Reminds me of Tony Abbott and his cheating “drive”.)