Florida primaries thread

Voting has begun in today’s Florida primaries, the last to be held before Super Tuesday apart from Republican caucuses in Maine on Saturday. For refusing to play by the rules of the parties’ national committees, Florida has been stripped of the 210 delegates it would normally send to the Democratic national convention, along with half of its 114 Republican delegates. All 57 of the Republican delegates will be pledged to the winning candidate, whereas the Democratic primary amounts to nothing more than an opinion poll. Polls show John McCain and Mitt Romney neck-and-neck in the Republican race, with Rudy Giuliani looking very unlikely to pull off his Florida-first strategy.

Author: William Bowe

William Bowe is a Perth-based election analyst and occasional teacher of political science. His blog, The Poll Bludger, has existed in one form or another since 2004, and is one of the most heavily trafficked websites on Australian politics.

1,099 comments on “Florida primaries thread”

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  1. as a point of interest
    heard helen reddy today on abc local radio-she made a very interesting point-that in her view americans would vote for a black man ahead of a woman-quite telling as she felt the public wasnt ready for a woman president.

  2. from the same article:

    California:
    Democrats: Obama 45%, Clinton 41%
    Republicans: Romney 37%, McCain 34%, Huckabee 12%, Paul 5%

    Georgia:
    Democrats: Obama 48%, Clinton 28%

    Missouri
    Democrats: Clinton 44%, Obama 43%
    Republicans: McCain 36%, Huckabee 27%, Romney 22%, Paul 4%

    New Jersey:
    Democrats: Clinton 43%, Obama 42%
    Republicans: McCain 54%, Romney 23%, Huckabee 6%, Paul 4%

    New York:
    Republicans: McCain 49%, Romney 23%, Huckabee 8%, Paul 6%

  3. 952
    davidoff

    the narrowing has happened !

    thought 4% is abit better than small lead despite the MOR
    David has California got 57 delegates the most or have I mixed the states

  4. 952
    davidoff

    let’s not forget Zogby’s New Hampshire poll! LOL

    But it looks like the big Mo is definitely with Obama and Clinton is fighting to hold her status as the top dog.

    Boy, ain’t Tsunami Tuesday going to be a ripper! Of course with the Dems arcane system of appointing delegates, with Obama this close to Clinton, it’s almost assured that she cannot knock him out on Tuesday. (Of course the polls could be dreadfully wrong too, and we’ve seen a couple of shockers).

  5. #954
    delegate count for the super-tuesday Democrats

    State/Allocated/Super

    Alabama 52 8
    Alaska 13 5
    Arizona 56 11
    Arkansas 35 12
    California 370 71
    Colorado 55 16
    Connecticut 48 12
    Delaware 15 8
    Georgia 87 16
    Idaho 18 5
    Illinois 153 32
    Kansas 32 9
    Massachusetts 93 28
    Minnesota 72 16
    Missouri 72 16
    New Jersey 107 20
    New Mexico 26 12
    New York 232 49
    North Decoda 2 13
    Oklahoma 38 9
    Tennessee 68 17
    Utah 23 6

  6. No we have renewed faith in the Polls now that Obama is ahead

    Whereas seriously the traditional betting agency odds have always been useless re Clinton vs Obama yet some quote them I don’t know why

    Obama’s odds were always ridiculously over the odds at 7/2 which have never reflected his chances but merely the ‘book’ on Clinton
    ..so you must be laughing KR at the the odds u got KR on Obama

  7. 958
    Erytnicam

    As Heraclitus, the ancient Greek philosopher once (almost) put it:

    “You cannot cry twice into the same election campaign”

    ..and this has stood the test of time, for over 2,000yrs!

  8. Erytnicam , we all will be so moved by their tears

    By the way when we had that fierce debate the other night before your exam,
    hope you acquitted yourself as well in the exam as u did in the debate ??

  9. 961
    davidoff

    yeah, the gloves will be well and truly off if they are seeing similar numbers.

    Gonna be hard for Bill to go into overdrive though, as the entire world will be watching his every twitch and magnifying it into a nuclear meltdown, and Hillary now MUST remain ‘presidential’ or else will look like a tacky loser.

    Nup, it’ll have to be via proxies or it’s going to be nasty to watch.

  10. Erytnicam , saw your blog with Diogenes who has unbelievable qualifications & it reminded me you were having an exam

    ….presume you passed with flying colours ?

    The problem for bill is he tried to get that ‘race’ and inexperience’ card out there
    and the media blew him up….he may well be in tears

    Would Heraclitus give dispensation to Bill to cry or has hillary used up the Clinton quota

  11. I don’t find out the result for a while, but Diogenes is too qualified for this blog 😀
    He reminds me of Dr Karl in being the sort of person who picks up degrees and knowledge for fun.
    And no offence meant in that debate, I think it was late at night and noone was quite understanding each other – rest assured I do think (the more I see it) that McCains abuse of his POW status is very similar to Giulianis abuse of 9/11.

    Also, did Adam leave this site, or has he just no blogged in a while, to return when Hillary wins with a massive ‘told you so’

  12. 950 erytnicam- I’m sorry to have to inform you and anyone who’s reading but most doctors, myself included, don’t know all that much about most drugs. GPs often are unaware of drug interactions, which happen frequently. Specialists know a lot about the drugs they commonly prescribe eg a cardiologist will know all the interactions and side-effects of calcium channel blockers etc but will have almost no idea about anti-epileptics for example. There are just too many drugs to know all the side-effects and drug interactions of all of them, unless you are a clinical pharmacologist. Some GPs are very good as well.

    I used to think it didn’t matter much, as the side effects were rarely serious and the drug interactions didn’t matter much until I read an article reporting the about 10% of all hospital admissions were due to adverse effects of prescribed drugs!!

  13. News from Alabama
    http://www.tuscaloosanews.com/article/20080202/NEWS/122394749/1007

    MONTGOMERY | A tracking poll by the Capital Survey Research Center released Friday showed Barack Obama, the U.S. senator from Illinois, polling 44.4 percent of the vote, and New York U.S. Sen. Hillary Clinton polling 37.4 percent inthe Democratic primary as of Thursday.

    Obama moved outside the margin of error in the poll for the first time. The margin of error in the Democratic poll was 5.1 percentage points.

    Just three days ago it was Obama 40 percent and Clinton 35 percent, with a margin of error of 5 percentage points.

  14. When it comes to dispensed drugs, there is no excuse for it reaching the patient no matter what the doctor screwed up – that’s our end of the bargain to double check your stuff before it goes out. Mind you drs can be right d*cks about it, I can remember on one of my first placements as an utter newbie being told to call up the doc about an incorrect script with me saying ‘did you mean to prescribe this’, which was followed by yes of course. The preceptor then called and said the same thing, and was welcomed with, why I will most certainly change that!
    The benefits of age and wisdom, one assumes.

  15. #971
    The subject of drug interactions is rather interesting because there are solutions to this. If you have a global pool of new data detailing prescriptions and follow-up symptoms – you can apply a lot of logic at the information systems level to identify potential issues. All you really need is a global base of information.

  16. Erytnicam
    u are 100% right , it was too late at night & we were not understanding each other & appreciate you saying so as thats what i thought the next day too

    Yep Rudy is doing a McCain over his 9/11 involvement

    Unfortunately I’d just seen a tape of McCain’s debate & he frustrated me enormously by saying anyone who opposed Iraq was not patriotic and that he should know because he was a POW

    I felt he had lost the right & respect to be called a war hero and so said he now is not one but you were right he is still one….perhaps now with with respect

    hope this clears us up Erytnicam as I have more than enough neo conservative
    opponents (some closet) on this blog

  17. Oh, I’d say most neo conservatives are pretty closeted if 2007 was anything to go by.

    *has a wide stance*

    After that, wide stance became my favorite term, because it makes me believe some people go to the bathroom as though they were giving birth.

  18. 970
    Erytnicam

    He’d hope for the latter, but his bragging rights might be shrinking quite a bit with each passing hour.

    She’ll get the majority vote, but some never suspected she’d not be a clear winner after Tuesday, and just go back and check some of the ‘snide’ posts if you don’t believe me!

    Anyone who questioned this ‘wisdom’ was treated as some sort of mentally challenged retard by a number of characters.

  19. #978
    On the subject of mentally challenged …
    I’ve just punched some numbers though a little engine of mine and I can see a scenario where Obama get more delegates than Clinton. This is based on my early projections but updated with the Zodgy numbers. Either way – post super tuesday – the race will continue with Obama and the Clintons.

  20. are you assuming California to Obama ??

    David
    have read that site you supplied on Obama’s wide ranging foreign Policy agenda

    …seems soundly based & virtually a reverse of George bush in evry respect

    That Alabama tracking Poll being outside the MOR range is a signifiant shift to Obama …wonder whether the former Edwards votes are reflected in some of this

  21. Here is the breakout for my Obama beats Clinton scenario:

    The numbers are basically the percentage difference in favor of Clinton for each of the states (i.e. a -7 means Obama ahead of clinton by 7%, a 5 means Clinton ahead of Obama by 5%). I then apply the number of delegates for each state relative to the projected result. Any states without numbers are resolved using an national average.

    Alabama -7
    Alaska 0
    Arizona 5
    Arkansas 0
    California -4
    Colorado -3
    Connecticut -2
    Delaware 0
    Georgia -20
    Idaho 0
    Illinois -30
    Kansas 0
    Massachusetts 6
    Minnesota 15
    Missouri 1
    New Jersey 1
    New Mexico 0
    New York 15
    North Decoda 0
    Oklahoma 25
    Tennessee 0
    Utah 0

  22. KR , I thought this may tickle your fancy

    On the other Thread this morning at blogs #132 & #134 you should read the 2
    blogers feeling distressed at the sledging they had recieved previously sometime

    One of the 2 was your annointee ‘Mr snide” !!!

    you’ll see my brief retort at #136 as I was moved to tears by their discomforture

  23. David

    am not questioning your analysis but can you clarify the following States Polls
    as electoral-vote.com says the Clinton/Obama vote %’s are

    not sure if they are pre or post Edwards but the Polls are dated to 31/1/08

    Massachusetts 50/35
    New jersey 50/38
    New York 55/33
    Tennessee 59/26

    which if correct may give hillary more delegates in these States but hope not

  24. #984
    a cut and paste issue – states which I’m applying a national average include Alaska, Arkansas, Delaware, Idaho, Kansas, New Mexico, North Dakota, Tennessee and Utah (which all represent rather small percentages in the overall equation)

  25. David I was wondering about these 4 states large pro Clinton Poll lead per 30/1/08 Polls listed on electoral-vote.com and whether your figures had Poll numbers with lower pro clinton leads in those 4 or similar

  26. #987

    David

    The name is ‘davidoff’ – one word.

    am not questioning your analysis

    You should – I do if that helps any.

    not sure if they are pre or post Edwards but the Polls are dated to 31/1/08

    I updated my numbers with the figure you supplied and I get the following result:
    Clinton 937 delegates, Obama 868 delegates (i.e. 52%/48%). We would need something like a 15% difference to see a knockout punch post super-tuesday and this is only 4%.

  27. well thats really encouraging because the figures I supplied from that web site
    aslo had 4 Polls averaged and those were only to 29/1/08 with Clinton 47 to 36

    and we know from your advice on the tracking polls California since has gone hifted massively & so perhaps the 4 states listed to the 31/1/08 have similarly moved

    in any event , the figures for the 4 States would seem the BEST Clinton can get…meaning your latest result of Obama with a 69 deficit may be close & Obama is very competitive one would feel

  28. these are my updated numbers based on your data

    Alabama -7
    Alaska
    Arizona 5
    Arkansas
    California -4
    Colorado -3
    Connecticut -2
    Delaware
    Georgia -20
    Idaho
    Illinois -30
    Kansas
    Massachusetts 15
    Minnesota 15
    Missouri 1
    New Jersey 12
    New Mexico
    New York 22
    North Dakota
    Oklahoma 25
    Tennessee 33
    Utah

    If anyone has any recommendations for changes I’ll be happy to plug numbers in a see where they take us.

  29. Davidoff

    to be precise with the dates the Polls were up to

    Massachusetts 50/35…30/1/08 ..2 averaged Polls
    New jersey 50/38……..31/1/08 ..2 averaged Polls
    New York 55/33……….31/1/08 ..2 averaged Polls
    Tennessee 59/26……..301/08 ..1 Poll

    agree with you there will be no knockout punch against Obama & also the momentium may build in his favour as future States voters know previous States voters supported Obama in big credibility numbers

  30. Here are my updated numbers resulting from some qualification of sentiments in those states that no polls exist for (mostly very conservative). I’ve based some numbers on past presidential elections so its not really comparing apples with apples but generally speaking – if I’m way out it will not matter because they don’t amount to a hill of beans in terms of delegates. I’ve moved New Jearsey back to a 1 point advantage to Hillary (preferring the more recent data from zogby). I’ve moved Alabama to 1 point advantage Obama based on competing suggestions of 6 point advantage asserted by the Hillary’s camp as opposed to a 6 point advantage to Obama from independent sources. The rest of the numbers are resolved based on data from usatoday, polster.com, zogby, data from Ron, data from Hillary’s site, and my own personal guesswork.

    Note – numbers reflect the percentage point advantage to Hillary over Obama.

    Alabama -1
    Alaska 15
    Arizona 5
    Arkansas 30
    California -4
    Colorado -3
    Connecticut -2
    Delaware 2
    Georgia -20
    Idaho 30
    Illinois -30
    Kansas -10
    Massachusetts 15
    Minnesota 15
    Missouri 1
    New Jersey 1
    New Mexico 4
    New York 16
    North Dakota 0
    Oklahoma 25
    Tennessee 33
    Utah 20

    Numbers crank out the following result (excluding superdelegates):

    Hillary 928 delegates (51%)
    Obama: 877 (49%)

  31. Earlier today in the Washington Post

    …Obama’s first destination: Boise, Idaho. In one of the nation’s most Republican and sparsely populated states, he drew more than 14,000 people to the Boise State University basketball arena — nearly three times as many people as voted in the state’s Democratic caucus in 2004.

    “They told me there weren’t any Democrats in Idaho. That’s what they told me,” Obama said. “I didn’t believe them.”

    Obama drew even bigger crowds later in the day in Minneapolis, where an estimated 18,000 filled the city’s basketball arena, and in St. Louis, where an estimated 20,000 came to a rally at a football stadium.

    …Those attending said they were grateful for the visit and stunned by the turnout. “It’s amazing,” said Katie Sewell, who works for the university. “It’s the most Republican state in the country, and look at this crowd. It can sort of feel hopeless being here and not believing what the majority here does, but this gives me hope.”

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