Weekend developments

Joel Fitzgibbon calls it a day, and other federal preselection news.

The opinion poll schedule for the week is likely to consist of the fortnightly Essential Research, which is not due to include the monthly leadership numbers and should thus be of limited interest (unless it includes their occasional dump of fortnightly voting intention results), and presumably a Roy Morgan voting intention poll on Wednesday.

For the time being, there is the following:

• The Australian reports that Labor MP Joel Fitzgibbon will bow out at the election, creating a vacancy in his seat of Hunter, where his margin was slashed from 12.5% to 3.0% at last year’s election with One Nation polling 21.6%. There is no indication as to who might succeed him as Labor candidate, except that “NSW Right figures (are) concerned Hunter could be lost to the faction and go to someone from the left-aligned CFMEU or the Australian Manufacturing Workers Union”.

• There would seem to be no suggestion that the vacancy in Hunter might change the calculus behind Kristina Keneally’s controversial move to Fowler, which was criticised over the weekend by her federal Labor colleague Anne Aly, along with many others inside and outside the party. However, Michelle Grattan in The Conversation notes that the arrangement does not of itself deprive the local party membership of a preselection ballot, since a clause in the state party rules specific to Fowler enshrines the seat as the gift of the Right as a legacy of past branch-stacking controversies.

• The West Australian reports on two further preselection challenges to sitting Liberals in Western Australia, on top of that facing Ian Goodenough in Moore from Vince Connelly after the abolition of his seat of Stirling. In Swan, where Steve Irons would appear to have his work cut out for him in defending a 3.2% margin, the challenger is Kristy McSweeney, a Sky News commentator, former adviser to Tony Abbott and daughter of former state MP Robyn McSweeney. McSweeney earlier contested preselection for the once safe but now Labor-held seat of Bateman ahead of the state election in March. In the much safer seat of Durack, Melissa Price will be challenged by Busselton councillor Jo Barrett-Lennard. For what it’s worth, The Age columnist Jon Faine today tells us to “watch out to see if former attorney-general Christian Porter opts for a spot on the Federal Court on the cusp of the election, rather than face probable defeat in his outer-suburban Perth electorate” – namely Pearce, where redistribution has cut the margin from 7.5% to 5.2%.

• As those who followed the post below will be aware, Labor recorded a strong result in the Northern Territory’s Daly by-election, with their candidate Dheran Young leading the count over Kris Civitarese of the Country Liberal Party by 1905 (55.8%) to 1506 (44.2%) with only a handful of votes left outstanding. This amounts to a 7.0% swing compared with the election last August, at which the CLP won the seat by 1.2%. It is the first time a government party has ever won a seat from the opposition at a by-election in the territory, and first time anywhere in Australia since the Benalla by-election in Victoria in May 2000.

Author: William Bowe

William Bowe is a Perth-based election analyst and occasional teacher of political science. His blog, The Poll Bludger, has existed in one form or another since 2004, and is one of the most heavily trafficked websites on Australian politics.

1,298 comments on “Weekend developments”

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  1. @seanrubensztein tweets

    Premier @GladysB deflected questions about these revelations at her presser. Said she locked down Greater Sydney hours after receiving advice to do so, but refused to reveal when she first knew NSW Health had lost control of the West Hoxton super spreader event 2 days earlier

    Breaking: The NSW Govt waited two days to lock down all of Sydney after health authorities discovered they had not contained a super-spreader event blamed for the Delta outbreak in the city’s west #nswpol #auspol

    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-09-13/nsw-waited-two-days-to-lock-down-over-west-hoxton-party/100456434

  2. @davidlipson tweets

    This is pretty extraordinary in communities we were told would be vaccine hesitant.
    Gladys: “Parts of SW Sydney went from 19 percent [vaccination] to nearly 90 now.. Like, Thankyou!”

  3. “The rest of the world is being given a wide range of affordable EV’s to give people better choices but Australia is missing out because of a total lack of policy and vision from the Morrison Government.”

    ***

    That and because Labor teamed up with the Coalition ensure EVs will be less affordable to everyday people.

    LABOR AND THE LIBERALS ON UNITY TICKET TO TAX EVS AND STYMY UPTAKE

    Today’s Senate debate on the Greens’ ‘No Electric Vehicles Tax’ Private Members Bill confirms both the government and Labor have no plan whatsoever to drive the uptake of electric vehicles or reduce our growing transport pollution.

    The COAG Reform Fund Amendment (No Electric Vehicle Taxes) Bill 2020 would end discriminatory taxation against electric vehicles by the states.

    But the major parties formed a unity ticket to refuse to pass this bill, and actively stymy the uptake of EVs at a time when Australia is already a laggard on the world’s stage.

    Australian Greens transport spokesperson, Senator Janet Rice, said:

    “Electric vehicles are the future of personal transport. But neither the government nor Labor can even work out an internally consistent policy between their federal and state governments.

    “Scott Morrison and Angus Taylor spruik ‘technology not taxes’ but won’t support our bill to get rid of the EV tax, and refuse to release a national strategy themselves. But the NSW Liberal Government has just announced EV incentives and more charging infrastructure.

    “Labor is no better. Anthony Albanese and Chris Bowen rail against the government for not having a national strategy and hobbling uptake, yet the Victorian Labor Government has passed a disastrous EV tax.”

    https://greens.org.au/vic/news/labor-and-liberals-unity-ticket-tax-evs-and-stymy-uptake

    Bowen is a hypocrite and Labor is a big part of the problem.

  4. “Don’t assume that at 80 per cent double-dose vaccination that unvaccinated people are are going to have all those freedoms. I want to make that point very clear,” she said.

    The Freedom of the Individual Party. Yeah right.

  8. @ShoebridgeMLC tweets

    The COVID oversight inquiry I Chair will today be asking the hard questions about what’s happening in rural and remote towns in NSW – these voices need to be heard in Parliament and we won’t stop fighting for these communities #nswpol

    Dr Malouf says First Nations people have historical issues with the health system. There is a need for the health system to administer the vaccine in a culturally safe and respectful manner.

    Wendy Spencer CEO, Dharriwaa Elders Group says that they can’t understand why police and the army are the ones resourced to respond to a public health emergency – this needs to urgently change.

  11. guytaursays:
    Monday, September 13, 2021 at 10:24 am

    Good Morning

    So today we have the official surrender of the coal lobby in Labor.

    —————

    You are unambiguously, an imbecile.

  13. Wendy Spencer CEO, Dharriwaa Elders Group says that they can’t understand why police and the army are the ones resourced to respond to a public health emergency

    That is so inappropriate. Someone with a tin ear in Macquarie Street made that decision. Have they no clue about the history of this country?

  14. Firefox2 @ #202 Monday, September 13th, 2021 – 10:11 am

    “The rest of the world is being given a wide range of affordable EV’s to give people better choices but Australia is missing out because of a total lack of policy and vision from the Morrison Government.”

    ***

    That and because Labor teamed up with the Coalition ensure EVs will be less affordable to everyday people.

    LABOR AND THE LIBERALS ON UNITY TICKET TO TAX EVS AND STYMY UPTAKE

    Today’s Senate debate on the Greens’ ‘No Electric Vehicles Tax’ Private Members Bill confirms both the government and Labor have no plan whatsoever to drive the uptake of electric vehicles or reduce our growing transport pollution.

    The COAG Reform Fund Amendment (No Electric Vehicle Taxes) Bill 2020 would end discriminatory taxation against electric vehicles by the states.

    But the major parties formed a unity ticket to refuse to pass this bill, and actively stymy the uptake of EVs at a time when Australia is already a laggard on the world’s stage.

    Australian Greens transport spokesperson, Senator Janet Rice, said:

    “Electric vehicles are the future of personal transport. But neither the government nor Labor can even work out an internally consistent policy between their federal and state governments.

    “Scott Morrison and Angus Taylor spruik ‘technology not taxes’ but won’t support our bill to get rid of the EV tax, and refuse to release a national strategy themselves. But the NSW Liberal Government has just announced EV incentives and more charging infrastructure.

    “Labor is no better. Anthony Albanese and Chris Bowen rail against the government for not having a national strategy and hobbling uptake, yet the Victorian Labor Government has passed a disastrous EV tax.”

    https://greens.org.au/vic/news/labor-and-liberals-unity-ticket-tax-evs-and-stymy-uptake

    Bowen is a hypocrite and Labor is a big part of the problem.

    How does this stop other measures being put in place?

  18. Cat

    Yeah as if Labor doesn’t do the same. That’s a two way street.

    I am happy Fitzgibbon is out. I am happy for Labor as much as anything else. That whole Friends of Coal business was just not a good look. Aligned with Matt Canavan.

  20. Younger tradies refusing to obey the rules? The bosses of the construction industries have asked the state for help.

    Victoria’s treasurer Tim Pallas has announced two new initiatives to try and get the state’s construction industry up and running at full capacity as soon as possible.

    And it consists of both the carrot and the stick:
    The nature of this workforce means that we have to go above and beyond the requirements for normal Covid compliance. So this is not about special provisions and exceptions for the construction industry. It’s about recognising that they have an obligation to go that little bit further given the opportunities that they have as permitted workers to continue to apply their trade…

    That’s why today we’re announcing two new initiatives – a priority vaccination access for construction workers and an enforcement blitz.

    So to support the construction industry, we’ll release 20,000 priority Pfizer appointments over the next week and unlimited access to AstraZeneca to all construction workers…

    We’ll be stepping up compliance and making sure that the industry in all its different manifestations recognises their obligations with regard to the chief health officer’s orders…

    We’ll have something like 50 teams out and about each and every day making sure that construction sites are doing the right thing and by themselves, by their employer, by their families and by their communities.
    We have heard from the industry itself who have told us they want more enforcement. And they want us to address those that aren’t doing the right thing.

    So I do want to acknowledge industry associations and unions, major industry players, who have made the point they have themselves a zero tolerance for non-compliance with the requirements and importantly, we need to see that replicated in every industry player.

    Everybody who constitutes the population of this industry needs to take these obligations seriously.

  21. guytaur @ #216 Monday, September 13th, 2021 – 12:30 pm

    Cat

    Yeah as if Labor doesn’t do the same. That’s a two way street.

    I am happy Fitzgibbon is out. I am happy for Labor as much as anything else. That whole Friends of Coal business was just not a good look. Aligned with Matt Canavan.

    I don’t disagree with you, guytaur. It’s just The Greens’ and their supporters here who will never admit that they are a political party who operate along the same lines as all the others that grinds my gears. It’s called being honest, open and transparent, qualities they demand of all other parties but do not display themselves, except in a purely performative sense. The sooner they admit this simple fact, the better. Then we could all go forward trying to win votes in an open, honest and transparent way. And spend no more time engaging in these petty, juvenile back and forth sniping spats.

  22. “You are unambiguously, an imbecile.”

    ***

    No, no he is not. I don’t always 100% agree with the position Guytaur takes, although quite often I do, but he is certainly one of the better posters on this blog and is always polite and respectful. He doesn’t deserve to be abused in this manner – nobody does.

  23. The MBA in ACT were having a vaccination clinic for tradies yesterday. They are usually sworn enemies of the ACT government but have been co-operative over Covid restrictions.

  24. Chris Gambian
    @chrisgambian
    ·
    2h
    On Saturday the NSW Govt quietly made it legal for rural landholders to clear up to 25 metres of bush from their boundary line, without an approval or assessment of ecological impact. Not recommended by the Bushfire Inquiry, not grounded in science. Slash and burn.

    Koala trees? Wildlife corridors? Windbreaks?

  25. More than a third of Australians — 37% — believe the latest round of lockdowns have had a positive impact on their ability to save, new research shows.

    Survey results released by UBank, National Australia Bank’s digital subsidiary, show that economic uncertainty sparked by the pandemic has sparked a savings spree by younger Australians.

    It found that, of those who said the pandemic positively changed their saving habits, 45% were millennials, with the next biggest cohort being Gen X, followed by boomers.

    Philippa Watson, chief executive at Ubank, said the research suggested the pandemic had reshaped spending and saving habits, especially among younger generations more adversely impacted by economic shutdowns.

    “We know young people have been disproportionately impacted by lockdown job losses, as they over-index in sectors such as hospitality and retail,” Watson said.

    She said uncertainty and enforced lockdowns were resulting in a “silver lining” in savings behaviours, noting, “The result is that saving for an emergency fund has overtaken saving for an overseas holiday as the top savings goal.”

  27. “. It’s just The Greens’ and their supporters here who will never admit that they are a political party who operate along the same lines as all the others ”

    ***

    What? When have we ever denied being a political party? We most certainly are that. Around one and a half million Australians make us that. We are the third force in Australian politics.

    What sets us apart from the “others” is that we are a grassroots progressive left wing party, not a party of the conservative right, as the Liberals, Labor, Nats, etc… all are to varying degrees.

  28. guytaur @ #217 Monday, September 13th, 2021 – 12:30 pm

    I am happy Fitzgibbon is out. I am happy for Labor as much as anything else. That whole Friends of Coal business was just not a good look. Aligned with Matt Canavan.

    Just because one Gibbon is out doesn’t mean Labor has changed. But it is becoming more critical that both Labor and the Liberals do so (the Nationals will never change) …

    This article was published in Nature this week …

    “Unextractable fossil fuels in a 1.5 °C world”

    https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-021-03821-8

    By 2050, we find that nearly 60 per cent of oil and fossil methane gas, and 90 per cent of coal must remain unextracted to keep within a 1.5 °C carbon budget. This is a large increase in the unextractable estimates for a 2 °C carbon budget, particularly for oil, for which an additional 25 per cent of reserves must remain unextracted. Furthermore, we estimate that oil and gas production must decline globally by 3 per cent each year until 2050. This implies that most regions must reach peak production now or during the next decade, rendering many operational and planned fossil fuel projects unviable. We probably present an underestimate of the production changes required, because a greater than 50 per cent probability of limiting warming to 1.5 °C requires more carbon to stay in the ground and because of uncertainties around the timely deployment of negative emission technologies at scale.

    And it is no longer enough to just reduce demand. We must also reduce supply …

    Central to pushing this transition forwards will be the domestic policy measures required to both restrict production and reduce demand. Increasing attention is being focused on supply-side policies that can complement carbon pricing and regulatory instruments that focus on demand20. Such policies act to curtail the extraction of fossil fuels and can include subsidy removal, production taxes, penalties for regulatory non-compliance and bans on new exploration and production. The development of international initiatives, such as the proposed non-proliferation treaty on fossil fuels, is also key as they could serve to foster global action, as could existing frameworks such as the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change.

    No new coal. No new oil. And no new gas. And no waiting for magic technologies to come to our rescue. Both Labor and the Liberals are still a long way from this position at both state and federal level, and there is very little time left to dither.

    Our best hope for forcing change is to give your first preference vote to independents and minor parties that will act on climate. We know this will work. It is very probably the the only thing that will.

  29. P1

    We need a change of government.

    For precisely the reasons you outline. I agree Labor and the Liberals are on the wrong side of science.

    I just think Labor will respond to minority voices truth telling on the science and that the LNP has proven they will not. See Malcolm Turnbull’s desperate efforts.

  30. “Just because one Gibbon is out doesn’t mean Labor has changed. ”

    ***

    Very true. For example…

    Federal Labor announce third generation coal miner Russell Robertson as Capricornia candidate

    LABOR leader Anthony Albanese has announced a third generation coal miner as the candidate for the seat of Capricornia at the next federal election.

    Russell Robertson is a father of three and has worked at the Goonyella Mine in the Bowen Basin for almost 20 years as an operator of heavy mining vehicles.

    The miner contested the seat at 2019 federal election, but lost to current Capricornia LNP MP Michelle Landry who received 62.4 per cent of the vote or 55,475 votes to Mr Robertson’s 37.6 per cent and 33,492 votes.

    …

    Mr Robertson said he’ll remain a strong advocate for the region’s coal mining industry.

    “The local coal mining industry has given me a job and helped my wife Denise and I put food on our family table for many years,” he said.

    Opposition leader Anthony Albanese joined Russell in Rockhampton last week to announce his candidacy.

    Mr Albanese said the Rockhampton local will be a “champion” for Central Queenslanders.

    https://www.queenslandcountrylife.com.au/story/7257374/federal-labor-announce-capricornia-candidate/

  32. “The local coal mining industry has given me a job and helped my wife Denise and I put food on our family table for many years,” he said.

    😆 Makes it sound like like he scapes by in his ‘humble’ job.

  34. It’s amazing how rapidly such a humble term ‘putting food on my table’ has become a euphemism for various crimes against humanity. I suppose it is the Capitalist/Democratic version of ‘I was just following orders’.

  35. a r says:
    Monday, September 13, 2021 at 1:17 pm

    Lurker @ #230 Monday, September 13th, 2021 – 1:14 pm

    We need to pull Carbon out of the air and convert it into Graphene. Then build a space elevator. I think.

    Have to get those pesky oxygens off it, first.
    ___________
    I recall a few years ago reading about various liquid metal catalysts operating at room temperature. Where in I reached the limit of my understanding of physics, that they were looking at.

  36. “Labor is no better. Anthony Albanese and Chris Bowen rail against the government for not having a national strategy and hobbling uptake, yet the Victorian Labor Government has passed a disastrous EV tax.”

    There is no rational reason for not taxing EVs, gst on EVs & gas burners contributes to general review, paying for health & education.

    If governments were keen to increase use of EV’s spending on improved EV infrastructure would be the way to go.. possibly aided by additional tax on gas burners.

  37. There was movement at the station …

    https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/sep/13/liberal-andrew-bragg-urges-scott-morrison-to-commit-to-net-zero

    But, as you would expect, the holdouts are the Nationals …

    Liberal moderates in metropolitan seats are now strongly of the view that it is politically untenable for the government to resist making a formal commitment to net zero. But Nationals championing fossil fuels in regional areas have signalled that they are strongly opposed to the government making that commitment.

    The Nationals claim their stance is all about jobs. And it is … their jobs.

  38. guytaur says:
    Monday, September 13, 2021 at 1:07 pm
    P1

    We need a change of government.

    Nevertheless, the Greens will do their level best to ensure this does not happen. They will continue to campaign 24/7 against Labor. Their own success depends on that.

  40. Lurker
    One problem would be what you are going to do with the tens of billions of tons of all that lovely carbon. Perhaps they could burn it and call it ‘renewable energy’ ? 😆

  41. Lurker @ #233 Monday, September 13th, 2021 – 11:18 am

    It’s amazing how rapidly such a humble term ‘putting food on my table’ has become a euphemism for various crimes against humanity. I suppose it is the Capitalist/Democratic version of ‘I was just following orders’.

    Your oh so superior aren’t you Nath.

    Some might same the same about bar owners.

  42. The Greens are never going to learn to be more than mediocre political misfits. It’s obvious they are going to point fingers at Coal Miners and Coal Mining and simplistically go, ‘Yah Boo! Coal Mining sucks!’ without being mature enough to acknowledge that there is a smart way and a dumb way, their way, to move to a future where Renewables become the dominant Energy supplier for our country. It’s certainly not going to be achieved by wasting their energy throwing tantrums about Coal, or by taking relentless potshots at the Labor Party. Though I guess that’s what their co-conspirators to attack Labor, the Liberal Party, think is the right thing for them to do, and they enthusiastically agree.

    Now, if they knew how to behave like rational adults, they would agree that this is the way we should go in order to achieve a just outcome for our fellow citizens AND a just outcome for the planet, because continually attacking the Labor Party will get them nowhere near where they say they want to go:

    Premier outlines plan for Collie’s Just Transition
    Wednesday, 9 December 2020

    New plan to support Collie’s transition away from emissions-intensive industries
    Huge take-up of renewable energy sees dependence on coal decline
    Just Transition plan supports workers and community during this process
    State Government will work with community to manage impacts
    McGowan Government has made unprecedented investment in Collie to diversify the local economy and secure town’s future
    The McGowan Government has announced its ‘Just Transition’ plan for Collie, a new framework to support workers and the wider community as the town transitions away from emissions-intensive industries.

    The plan has been developed in consultation with industry, community, union and government stakeholders, through the Just Transition Working Group, and is the next step in what is recognised will be a 10 to 15-year transition process for Collie.

    It will ensure that the needs of impacted workers and the wider community are at the forefront of the process, and recognises that early action on a Just Transition can minimise the negative impacts and maximise positive opportunities.

    As part of the plan, the Just Transition Working Group has developed a group of principles endorsed by the State Government to guide transition efforts:

    encourage sound investments in low emission and job-rich sectors and technologies that attract and maintain local employment opportunities;
    recognise, promote and celebrate the history, cultural heritage and invaluable contribution the town of Collie and associated coal and power generation industries have made and continue to make to the State of Western Australia;
    respect the rights of those affected by transition to be treated with justice and dignity;
    ensure all consultation and negotiations are honest, open and transparent and work towards achieving consensus on goals, timelines and pathways;
    recognise that ‘we’re all in this together’, and thus share the challenges and opportunities transition brings – the objective is to see that no-one is left behind;
    strive to ensure that all those affected by transition are given comprehensive information, opportunity and choice to retrain, reskill/upskill or take an alternative pathway within a reasonable timeframe;
    organise local, long-term economic diversification plans that support worthwhile occupations and foster continuous improvement in local living standards for current and future generations; and
    provide policy, social support and linkages to community and government services for the benefit of all those affected by transition.
    While individual companies will retain responsibility for supporting workers, there will be a role for the State Government in supporting the broader community and local economy, and co-ordinating regional opportunities.

    Over the past four years, the McGowan Government has made an unprecedented investment in Collie to diversify the local economy and secure the town’s future. The investment includes:

    $60 million for the Collie Industry Attraction and Development Fund, including:
    $10 million for adventure bike trails around Collie;
    $13.4 million for the Koolinup Emergency Services Centre in Collie including an Incident Control Centre, Emergency Driver Training School and regional fleet maintenance;
    $1.5 million ‘mural trail’ project – Wellington Dam’s huge 367m x 34m wall face will provide the canvas for the mural, with a series of smaller murals painted by WA and South-West artists as part of a ‘mural trail’;
    $4.5 million for tourism-readiness projects in Collie;
    $2.5 million for Frontline Fire & Rescue Equipment to establish an emergency vehicle manufacturing facility in Collie; and
    $300,000 to move DMIRS’ regional licensing processing centre to Collie
    $18 million for the Collie Futures Fund, including:
    $1 million for remediation works to bring the Collie Roundhouse to a lease-ready state; and
    $2.8 million to support establishment of the WesTrac Technology Training Centre.

    For more information on the Just Transition plan, visit https://www.wa.gov.au

    https://www.mediastatements.wa.gov.au/Pages/McGowan/2020/12/Premier-outlines-plan-for-Collies-Just-Transition.aspx

    This is what mature, responsible and intelligent political parties do. Not useless crackpots like The Greens.

  43. I don’t think you’d need to go to GeoSynch. That would be impossible I would think. I always thought the proposals were to get to Lower Earth Orbit. Which is where the ISS is, I don’t see why you would want to go further.

  44. Firefox2 says:
    Monday, September 13, 2021 at 1:08 pm
    “Just because one Gibbon is out doesn’t mean Labor has changed. ”

    ***

    Very true. For example……..

    Illustrating for all to see that the Greens are an anti-worker outfit. They might purport to be “progressive”, but in fact they are hostile to workers and to the political and industrial organs of working people.

    It is not possible to be both “progressive” and to cling to anti-Labor strategies. By their hostility to Labor, the Greens out themselves as an anti-Progressive assembly.

  45. poroti says:
    Monday, September 13, 2021 at 1:26 pm

    Lurker
    One problem would be what you are going to do with the tens of billions of tons of all that lovely carbon. Perhaps they could burn it and call it ‘renewable energy’ ?
    __________________
    Spaceships Poroti. We make spaceships. Or just other stuff made of Graphene. Giant space stuff.

  46. “Just because one Gibbon is out doesn’t mean Labor has changed. ”

    Says the Liberal voter and resident PB court jester, who crosses their fingers behind their back every time they comment and hopes people won’t remember what galling hypocrisy is behind every comment they make.

  47. Our best hope for forcing change is to give your first preference vote to independents and minor parties that will act on climate. We know this will work. It is very probably the the only thing that will.

    …that is, P1 is urging votes for those who have no hope whatsoever of ever wielding power…the Clayton’s vote….the Deflection vote…

    P1, Barnaby Joyce’s echo, is calling for nothing of substance to be done, ever.

  48. Cat

    The Greens are not crackpots
    ‘You forget in your blind partisanship. The carbon price was both Labor AND Greens policy along with all the transitionalf mechanism.

    It was not Labors fault or the Greens that voters were fed a lie by the LNP and media. Sure we can blame Labor for errors in the campaign but make no mistake.
    The Carbon Tax Lie was as big as Trump’s Big Lie. It’s just Trumps attacks on facts were also a direct attack on democracy.

  49. Lurker @ #242 Monday, September 13th, 2021 – 11:27 am

    I don’t think you’d need to go to GeoSynch. That would be impossible I would think. I always thought the proposals were to get to Lower Earth Orbit. Which is where the ISS is, I don’t see why you would want to go further.

    The elevator has to go past geosynchronous orbit.

    That’s where it’s centre of mass needs to be for it to apparently stay stationary above a point on the earth. Another point is that it can only be built on the equator.

  50. Barney in Tanjung Bunga says:
    Monday, September 13, 2021 at 1:33 pm

    Lurker @ #242 Monday, September 13th, 2021 – 11:27 am

    I don’t think you’d need to go to GeoSynch. That would be impossible I would think. I always thought the proposals were to get to Lower Earth Orbit. Which is where the ISS is, I don’t see why you would want to go further.

    The elevator has to go past geosynchronous orbit.

    That’s where it’s centre of mass needs to be for it to apparently stay stationary above a point on the earth. Another point is that it can only be built on the equator.
    ___________________
    Fair enough, I’m not up on that stuff too much, but when I heard of the proposal I couldn’t conceive of such a span. I wonder if it would have any impact on the rotation of the earth or other things.

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