The Age/Herald has a Resolve Strategic poll which finds no sign in the ongoing weakening of support for an Indigenous Voice, to the extent of being the first significant poll to find no in front, albeit by a 51-49 margin that places the difference inside the margin of error. This followed a question in which respondents were told of the referendum question wording and the fact of voting being compulsory. Minus the latter prompt, 42% were in favour, 40% opposed and 18% undecided.
State breakdowns suggest the proposal is also falling short on the other leg of the dual majority requirement, with majorities in favour in only three states: by 53-47 in New South Wales, 56-44 in Victoria and 57-43 from a tiny sample in Tasmania, with no leading 56-44 in Queensland, 51-49 in Western Australia and 52-48 in South Australia. The national results are from the pollster’s latest national survey, which reached 1606 respondents and was presumably conducted from Wednesday to Sunday, while the state results pad out the sample with findings from last month’s poll, which had yes leading 53-47. Voting intention numbers will presumably follow at some point in the next day or two.
In an emerging pattern, it’s a very different story from Essential Research, which according to a report in The Guardian finds 60-40 in favour on its forced response Indigenous Voice question, effectively unchanged on its 59-41 result a month ago. A separate report in The Guardian tells us Essential’s fortnightly poll also included a regular suite of questions on best party to handle various issues, which found Labor favoured to handle issues including cost of living, interest rates and government debt, together with its more traditional strengths of health and welfare, climate change and security of work.
Respondents were asked how much or how little they felt various factors were to blame for rising interest rates, but the results are hard to interpret without seeing the question wording and response structure. For this we must await the release of the full report later today – together with voting intention numbers, on which The Guardian’s report is silent, though they are presumably favourable to Labor given the “best party to handle” responses.
Socrates @ #245 Tuesday, June 13th, 2023 – 8:38 pm
Soc. Reynolds is good little (expendable) soldier for the WA Spivs. She’ll go over the top if Stokes et al. tell her to. It’s all they have left.
Morrison delivered shame, disgrace and ignominy at the last election.
The Coalition have not conceptualized their defeat.
The attempt to create Gallaghate is childishly simplistic.
The polls haven’t budge in any manner or form that could even be regarded as encouraging.
The Liberal need to visit an optometrist and have their political eyes checked out.
Dutton should begin with an apology to the voters for being so pathetic.
Bit of the old Chester A Arthur society there, Sprocket?
Imagine if Sprocket got to meet Chris Christie?
Sprocket could probably entice him with a meat pie , coke and a vanilla slice to wash it down – whilst admiring his large physique and getting the special camera out.
Rhwombat
After the outcome of the Porter and BRS trials, you would think they would learn.
Those that do not study the history of defamation trials seem doomed to repeat them.
Lars Von Trier says:
Tuesday, June 13, 2023 at 9:13 pm
Imagine if Sprocket got to meet Chris Christie?
Sprocket could probably entice him with a meat pie , coke and a vanilla slice to wash it down – whilst admiring his large physique and getting the special camera out.
_________________
🙂
Probably a very large net nearby for sprocket to capture and then haul his prize.
Socrates:
Tuesday, June 13, 2023 at 8:38 pm
[‘Mavis
Thanks for your earlier comments on the Trump hearing. Surely they give extra points on flight risk for someone who owns his own plane and has his tax affairs based in foreign tax havens??’]
Forfeiture of his passport would be a good start, though such is highly doubtful, the presiding judge won’t even consider same.
Trump loaded US federal judges’ appointments so as to be amenable; this can be seen with Cannon’s appointment. Having said that, I think Trump will meet the same end of McCarthy:
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/videos/joseph-mccarthys-downfall-was-accusing-the-ar/
“This is a combined Liberal-Newscorp operation.”
Absolutely no doubt. This is becoming the worst double act in politics.
Speaking of trials socrates, how did your friends go, you know the ones who sieged Nicolle Flint’s electorate office? Did they end up beating the rap?
I find it hard to believe that any Florida jury won’t contain at least one Trump sympathizer
“ Imagine if Sprocket got to meet Chris Christie?
Sprocket could probably entice him with a meat pie , coke and a vanilla slice to wash it down – whilst admiring his large physique and getting the special camera out.”
________
https://youtu.be/eAUYO6AY1ow
Speaking of food. Anyone seen The Menu? A flawed movie, but at times, something like a masterpiece.
The fiberals and newscorp are truly vile
——-
Brittany Higgins has released explosive transcripts contradicting Michaelia Cash’s claims of what she knew and when — embarrassingly, just days after Cash called for a corruption inquiry into who in Labor knew what and when. #auspol
I have always thought things like the allegations against Bruce Lehrmann were best left to Courts to deal with not trial by media.
I remember the absolute lynch mob on here – including some who were speculating if Lehrmann checking himself into a mental hospital was a ruse to avoid media scrutiny.
Still it does seem like those who chose to initiate trial by media – cannot complain too much when trial by media is visited upon them.
Enough Already at 6.17 am & Oliver Sutton at 6.28 am re the Don’t Knows
There is irony in an article by Peter Lewis on his Essential poll re Voice:
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/commentisfree/2023/jun/13/the-poltico-media-complex-has-turned-balance-into-an-outrage-machine-putting-the-voice-at-risk
The irony is that Lewis correctly rebukes the media for recycling crude distortions about the Voice proposal as news, yet the framing of the “closed choice” options for voting No in his survey reinforces just that.
Of the limited 4 options, the first two (“divisive”, and “privileges” that aren’t mine) are more or less the same, and repeat LNP propaganda.
While it appears that two thirds of intending No voters think that way, and are therefore unlikely to reconsider, the actual proportion may be somewhat smaller, because another reason (don’t know) was not given.
Option 4 (Indigenous Australians don’t agree on the Voice) is too silly for words, as if any policy needs unanimity before it could be supported. The 7% of No voters in the Essential poll who took that option might well be persuadable about one thing one day, and the opposite the next day.
Option 3 is also implicitly loaded with LNP bullshit: “It won’t make a real difference to the lives of ordinary Indigenous Australians”, as if there is a credible distinction between ordinary and non-ordinary First Peoples. It is unclear what that reason means, except it has more support among soft rather than hard No voters, those who potentially may reconsider.
One quite significant reason for many intending No voters was missing, i.e. not given as an option. This is the insufficient information to decide reason, currently probably widespread. Given the poor awareness of the Uluru Statement in that poll, that unsolicited reason is clearly pertinent.
Some weeks ago @sprocket had a graph indicating as much, probably from the mid-May Freshwater poll. The report about that poll says:
“Worryingly for advocates of a constitutionally enshrined Voice, less than half of respondents say they have sufficient information on the proposal, although at 46 per cent, the proportion of respondents who say they have sufficient information to make an informed decision has risen 6 points since December.”
https://www.afr.com/politics/federal/public-support-shifting-away-from-the-voice-poll-20230519-p5d9nv
It is a worry only if the Yes campaign is unable to fill the information gap about the Voice, and the clear historical reason for entrenching the Voice in the Constitution.
That reason is that all previous national representative bodies for First Peoples have been abolished by governments, with Labor’s embryonic rat Latham helping Howard to abolish ATSIC nearly twenty years ago.
If you want to hear a careful and informed account of the background to the Voice proposal, listen to this podcast by Kado Muir, an Aboriginal anthropologist who almost got elected to the Senate in 2016, standing as the lead candidate for the WA Nationals, who actually support the Voice:
https://www.audacy.com/podcast/my-culture-story-with-kado-muir-152c0/episodes/episode-32-politics-is-yuckity-yak-but-why-the-voice-68ff7
There is one minor error, in that he refers to ATSIC existing in the 1980s, when it was created in 1989, but it is an informative talk, worth hearing.
Because the sample sizes are too small, there is little credible evidence about state by state polling trends re the Voice, except that Qld is the most likely state to vote No. Yet WA will not be like Qld, partly because the WA Nationals are quite different to Barnaby’s bumpkins.
Watermelon:
Tuesday, June 13, 2023 at 9:19 pm
[‘I find it hard to believe that any Florida jury won’t contain at least one Trump sympathizer’]
I think they describe thus as inveterate vetting. I’m now deferring to Mahler, who Keating made an almost musical master out of him.
TPOF,
It’s obvious to me that the Liberals are yet to realise that one of the main reasons they lost the 2022 election was as a result of the many examples, during their time in office, of the atrocious way they treated women, from Julia Banks, to Christine Holgate, and Brittany Higgins. Which led to the virtual collapse of the female vote for the Liberals and the rise of the Teals. Which was put up in lights again by Kylea Tink and Zoe Daniel bringing points of order in Question Time today, reminding the Coalition of the damage their tactics will cause the vulnerable.
And yet, the Coalition are going down that road again!
Not to mention on the day when, former Prime Minister, Scott Morrison, employing the pretzel logic and obfuscation that he is infamous for, admitted to misleading parliament wrt the same issue!
I don’t understand what the Liberals are ultimately trying to achieve in raising the Brittany Higgins issue again. Sure it might go some way to making Labor look like it’s been tarnished from it as well but it’s likely going to damage the Liberals even more re-hashing this whole saga. It’s also just distasteful and pointless.
All that is left in the LNP it seems is vacuous, confected melodrama in an attempt to drag everyone else down with them as they degenerate into an increasingly irrelevant state.
PageBoi @ #211 Tuesday, June 13th, 2023 – 6:48 pm
Exactly correct. Might make the next EV a BYD though. Tesla used to be the only viable option. Not so anymore.
Taylormade @ #213 Tuesday, June 13th, 2023 – 6:51 pm
I know that nobody believes you.
ROFL TailoredMerde
Lars
That goes back a few years! I never condoned the vandalism of Nicolle Flint’s office (spraying graffiti on it highlighting her views). However I supported the office protest and said at the time Flint’s complaints were greatly exaggerated. Some of the incidents Flint alleged simply never happened. I would describe most of it as nothing more than a picket of her office.
I believe one individual who was not a member of Labor, Getup or the Extinction Rebellion protest group was convicted of stalking (threatening) Flint and correctly so. He was a rather weird sixty year old man who frequented the area.
https://www.smh.com.au/national/albanese-concedes-poor-treatment-of-female-liberal-mp-by-labor-20210317-p57bdn.html
I’m not aware that anyone from the protest group got more than a caution. So the court didn’t see it Flint’s way either.
The recent protest in Adelaide that blocked traffic on the approach to the RA Hospital was different. It inconvenienced the public, not just politicians and was by a group who I do agree are too extreme. They are not friends and I have nothing to do with them.
“Might make the next EV a BYD though. Tesla used to be the only viable option. Not so anymore.”
Watching. Waiting. Anticipating.
The 12yo i30 is starting to get that sweet smell of leaking coolant and oil on the exhaust manifold.
For those interested this is an NZ youtube series that roadtests the (larger) range of EVs on sale in NZ. This test is quite recent on the new BYD Atto3 vs MG4.
IMO both are good value entry level EVs under $50k Aus before any subsidy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3KaKeh_ky0
The number of EVs in this price range in Australia should increase rapidly if we adopt the EU or UK emissions policy soon.
Dandy Murray @ #272 Tuesday, June 13th, 2023 – 10:12 pm
https://www.penrithautorecyclers.com.au/files/hyundai-i30-replacement-engines.php
Socrates
The recent protest in Adelaide that blocked traffic on the approach to the RA Hospital was different. It inconvenienced the public, not just politicians and was by a group who I do agree are too extreme. They are not friends and I have nothing to do with them.
This would be Extinction Rebellion? They are no friends of mine either. Their tactics are “punch down”: disrupting the lives of everyday workers and commuters, just to make a point.
ER could target those in authority (in government or industry), but instead they go for soft targets: ordinary people just trying to make a crust. Their tactics are cowardly and counterproductive.
Yep yabba, I did that back in the day with the old VW T3 before driving around Europe for a few months…
”
rhwombatsays:
Tuesday, June 13, 2023 at 8:48 pm
Socrates @ #245 Tuesday, June 13th, 2023 – 8:38 pm
Mavis
Thanks for your earlier comments on the Trump hearing. Surely they give extra points on flight risk for someone who owns his own plane and has his tax affairs based in foreign tax havens??
Holden Hillbilly
“ Linda Reynolds is threatening to sue Tanya Plibersek for defamation over comments she made about the former defence minister’s knowledge of Brittany Higgins’ rape allegations.”
Unbelievable She does understand that Plibersek would get to do discovery on all of Reynolds’ communications and could oblige Reynolds to be cross examined over things like… why did you get your office steam cleaned? What a stupid bluff.
Soc. Reynolds is good little (expendable) soldier for the WA Spivs. She’ll go over the top if Stokes et al. tell her to. It’s all they have left.
”
It appears that Stokes has gone bonkers especially after BRS defamation case.
With ex-WA Labor PM McGowan gone he could be thinking his road his clear to down ALP in WA and at federal level. We all know his antipathy towards Labor, which he discussed with Murdoch as per Turnbull.
”
Socratessays:
Tuesday, June 13, 2023 at 9:15 pm
Rhwombat
After the outcome of the Porter and BRS trials, you would think they would learn.
Those that do not study the history of defamation trials seem doomed to repeat them.
”
Socrates
I don’t know whom you are referring to but it appears Stokes has gone bonkers with BRS trail if as they say he funded BRS defamation case.
The word senile comes to mind as one gets older.
Mavis says:
Tuesday, June 13, 2023 at 9:59 pm
Watermelon:
Tuesday, June 13, 2023 at 9:19 pm
[‘I find it hard to believe that any Florida jury won’t contain at least one Trump sympathizer’]
I think they describe thus as inveterate vetting. I’m now deferring to Mahler, who Keating made an almost musical master out of him.
……………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………..
Ah yes, Keating the Musical and The Gosple According To Paul.
Mahler and antique clocks.
Enough Already 8:08pm
Most welcome although remember, I’m no prophet. I do have higher HQ direct planning experience at Brigade, Divisional and Joint Force HQ Level but I’m only pontificating on the little I can glean from the maps, topography, troop and armament dispositions that I’m aware of (and there’s lots I’m not aware of). The principles are no doubt similar but times have moved on since my involvement in operational level strategy and planning.
Ven
Yes that is who I was referring too (Stokes + Libs).
Shogun
Yes agreed. My friends are in Getup. I saw their protest at Flint’s office and nobody outside the office was inconvenienced. XR only harm the cause.
Night all.
Dandy Murray says:
Tuesday, June 13, 2023 at 10:12 pm
“Might make the next EV a BYD though. Tesla used to be the only viable option. Not so anymore.”
Watching. Waiting. Anticipating.
The 12yo i30 is starting to get that sweet smell of leaking coolant and oil on the exhaust manifold.
The Mitsubishi has done 300,000 and it’s due for a new turbo charger. Model 3 long range looks like the go.
nath says:
Tuesday, June 13, 2023 at 9:24 pm
Speaking of food. Anyone seen The Menu? A flawed movie, but at times, something like a masterpiece.
……………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………….
98.6 reviews the reviews.
I looked up the trailers and reviews of The Menu and it reminded me of a cult movie back in 1989 ish called The Cook, The Thief, his Wife and her Lover.
If The Menu is half as good as it was, it should be like you say, a masterpiece.
Thanks for the heads up.
Taylormade
AKA the seagull – he lands, he shits, and he takes off again.
At 6:51 he posted that no one believes K Gallagher. Well a lot more people will believe her than those who believe the pathological liars in the Morrison Government.
This bloke reckons Dutton lies. Who knew?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhSZ54Hs-bg&ab_channel=KangarooCourtofAustralia
Further to the last post, at the end of this we see a backdown by Senator Reynolds.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhCVn75HYpg&ab_channel=KangarooCourtofAustralia
Can not see how a politician suing another politician can be a win.
What’s happened to the brands we knew and trusted ?
Up until two weeks ago I’d never heard of BYD cars.
Now, they seem to be on everyone’s mind.
I heard on radio today that KIA is Australia’s third highest selling brand car.
Hows that ? It seems like they have only been around for five minutes.
Once MGs were small sports cars, now they are no 7 in the marketplace.
Is it the power of advertising ?
Once Philips made everything that was electrical when they the biggest company on earth.
Now few would know they exist.
Is there still such a thing as BRAND POWER ?
The Newscorpse-Liberal witch hunt continues:
“Katy keeps quiet with PM’s ‘1000pc’ support
Senior Labor ministers defend their roles in politicising Brittany Higgins’ rape allegations because it made parliament safer for women.”
“Coalition plays long game as PM gambles on Gallagher
The Prime Minister has wagered his own standing on the perceived integrity of Katy Gallagher. For the opposition, this is a slow burn.”
“MeToo narrative in spotlight as media campaign backfires
The strategy of making this a media and political story instead of a criminal justice matter was a deliberate choice by Higgins and her advisers.”
Absolute gutter journalism.Should be ashamed of themselves.
A sad update on the criminal Russian strike on Kryvyi Rih:
“At least 10 people [up from 6 earlier] were killed in a Russian missile strike on the central Ukrainian city of Kryvyi Rih on Tuesday, the city mayor has said.”
https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2023/jun/13/russia-ukraine-war-live-massive-missile-attack-launched-on-city-of-kryvyi-rih-ninety-square-km-of-donetsk-retaken-says-kyiv
🙁
steve davissays:
Tuesday, June 13, 2023 at 11:40 pm
The Newscorpse-Liberal witch hunt continues:
“Katy keeps quiet with PM’s ‘1000pc’ support
Senior Labor ministers defend their roles in politicising Brittany Higgins’ rape allegations because it made parliament safer for women.”
“Coalition plays long game as PM gambles on Gallagher
The Prime Minister has wagered his own standing on the perceived integrity of Katy Gallagher. For the opposition, this is a slow burn.”
“MeToo narrative in spotlight as media campaign backfires
The strategy of making this a media and political story instead of a criminal justice matter was a deliberate choice by Higgins and her advisers.”
Absolute gutter journalism.Should be ashamed of themselves.
====================
The media as it operated in the 20th century is redundant these days. It has some influence but significantly less than it used to, especially true among under 40’s who don’t understand why ppl pay for tripe.
Plibersek’s arch response to Reynolds’ concerns notice:
“I received this interesting letter today. As far as I’m concerned, all legal options are on the table.”
And Higgins’ pointed response to a tweet about Cash’s knowledge of the allegations:
“October 2019”
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/jun/13/linda-reynolds-threatens-to-sue-tanya-plibersek-over-brittany-higgins-comments
trumpy’s a popular boy… NOT
“Trump finds no new lawyers for court appearance in Mar-a-Lago case”
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jun/13/trump-finds-no-new-lawyers-mar-a-lago-documents-arraignment
New thread.
A few years ago we had many such protests in Brisbane with the protesters glueing hands to the road and disrupting peak hour transport etc. These are the sort of groups that think throwing tinned spaghetti at a masterpiece painted in the time of horses and candles is legitimate protest. I mostly agree with their aims but can guarantee them they are p***ing off just about 90% of people and giving the LNP/ Murdochcracy newspaper type conservatives a spiked club to hit all who believe climate action is imperative, over the head.
Andrew_Earlwood @ 8.17pm.
Thanks Andrew.
As Paul Keating once said, “There is nothing more Ex, than an Ex-Prime Minister”.
Surely, there is nothing more Ex, than an Ex-Senator.
Rex Patrick may have once been a sub-mariner, but does that give him the authority and status to regularly attempt to tell the current government what they should and should not do in matters regarding maritime defence.
He was elected to the Senate as a member of the Nick Xenophon Team – and with the crash of that cultist group remained as a Senator, representing nobody.
If he had been considered to be an active and representative Senator for South Australia he would have been duly re-elected by the South Australian electorate.
The electorate has spoken, it is time for Rex to enjoy his retirement.