I had a paywalled article in Crikey yesterday that riffed off South Australian Opposition Leader Peter Malinauskas’s pointedly supportive approach to the state’s brief COVID-19 lockdown, and the explicit distinction he drew between his own approach and that of Michael O’Brien in Victoria. It was noted that Malinauskas clearly believes the general tenor of polling coming out of Victoria, even if the likes of Peta Credlin do not. This also afforded me the opportunity to highlight a clip from September in which Credlin and two Sky-after-dark colleagues brought their formidable perspicacity to bear on the likely impact of Queensland’s hard border policies on the looming state election.
Speaking of the which, both Antony Green and Kevin Bonham offer extremely detailed post-match reports on the Queensland election, in which both try their hand at estimating the statewide two-party preferred: Antony Green coming in at 53.2% for Labor, and Kevin Bonham making it 53.1%. This represents either a 1.8% or 1.9% swing to Labor compared with the 2017 election result of 51.3%, which was barely different from the 2015 result of 51.1%. Annastacia Palaszczuk can now claim the vanishingly rare distinction of having increased her party’s seat share at three successive elections. For further insights into how this came about, JWS Research has published full results of its post-election poll.
Elsewhere, Western Australia’s Liberal Party will today choose a new leader after the resignation on Sunday of Liza Harvey, who came to the job last June but has been politically crippled by COVID-19 — a no-win situation for the Liberals in the best of circumstances, but one made quite a lot worse than it needed to be by a response that was more Michael O’Brien than Peter Malinauskas. The two contenders are Zak Kirkup, 33-year-old member for the all too marginal seat of Dawesville in southern Mandurah, and Bateman MP Dean Nalder, who unsuccessfully challenged Colin Barnett’s leadership six months before the Liberals’ landslide defeat in March 2017. The West Australian reports that Zirkup has it all but stitched up, since he has the support of Harvey as well as key numbers men Peter Collier and Nick Goiran.
guytaur @ #196 Tuesday, November 24th, 2020 – 1:36 pm
Gillard should be seen as a Labor hero by the partisans for salvaging a minority Govt despite the level of internal treachery.
The experience of the Gillard Government proved once and for all that Labor cannot trust the Greens. The Greens are treachery itself.
Non @ #199 Tuesday, November 24th, 2020 – 1:41 pm
Labors policy confusion brought it undone.
Too many competing interests that led to a dogs breakfast of a policy framework.
To top it off, a neoliberal Treasurer candidate that couldn’t even see his way to increasing the Jobseeker rate was never going to appeal.
“It’s time you and Labor get over it.
Stop whining you did not have more time.”
Own your words Guytaur
Yeah, Bowen the Brave stuffed up. Correctly, he stepped down. His main error was in not making LNP mismanagement the focus of his effort. His second error was to promise to increase taxes. His third error was to make those increases discriminatory. Hopefully he will not be allowed near anything important again.
“Agreed, which is why I’m comfortable criticising the Labor party.”
***
Nah, you’re not comfortable, you’re disillusioned. Huge difference.
Like I said, when I have something to criticise, I will let you know. I’m not going to start making things up just to make you feel better about supporting Labor. I’m really happy with how the Greens are going.
Why criticise others for supporting the parties of the establishment which are stuffing the world? Gee, maybe because I give a damn? I know that is a foreign concept to conservative right wingers though.
I’m not having a go at people for being partisan, I’m having a go at them for allowing themselves to be brainwashed into supporting bad policies and bad people. I’m having a go at them for being so blindly partisan and obedient that they refuse to acknowledge undeniable facts.
No, telling lies about others is not pretty, is it, it’s just really pathetic and cowardly. Nice to see you engaging in a bit of self-reflection for a change though.
[‘This represents either a 1.8% or 1.9% swing to Labor compared with the 2017 election result of 51.3%, which was barely different from the 2015 result of 51.1%. Annastacia Palaszczuk can now claim the vanishingly rare distinction of having increased her party’s seat share at three successive elections.’]
This represents clear evidence that Labor can do well in Queensland. At the federal level, ditto if Labor takes policies to the election that are comprehensible, sold well, and don’t scare the horses. On any criteria, such was absent in 2019. Also important is that Palmer has lost nearly all electoral credibility thus his ad campaign will fall flat on voters, whereas in 2019 they little doubt helped to Tories.
Scout
That’s not abusive.
That’s an opinion you don’t like hearing.
As I said to you.
Ten years of Labor self justification. I said you because you brought up Rudd’s CPRS.
That’s only brought up to excuse the Labor whine to scapegoat the Greens.
The fact is the Greens voted to support Labor’s Carbon Price.
When you can come back with a Green Australian government. Then you can blame the Greens for failures of major parties to act on climate not before.
It was Labor’s legislation. The Greens voted for it. They did while supporting confidence so the government was even in a position to introduce the legislation.
I think I am being very restrained in using the word whining.
Florida man wrestles with alligator to save his King Charles spaniel:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cT71bEbLJNw
‘friendlyjordies@friendlyjordies ·1h
Big big big expose coming out 10am tomorrow. Should really further highlight the character of a certain senior politician.’
Gladys?
“The fact is the Greens voyted to support Labor’s Carbon Price.”
***
Just a slight correction: The Carbon Price/ETS was a Greens policy which we got Labor to support, not the other way around.
The Labor policy at the time was to have a “Citizen’s Assembly.”
Victoria Labor government hands down a State budget for the people and the environment.
Addressing social housing and affordability for renters.
Sure to get the Greenies and both the Libs/Nats on this site enraged.
I mean, how dare they!
Yeah, the adoption of Green policy by Gillard precipitated her political destruction. Never Again!
Firefox
I disagree.
Labor was using the mechanism of a citizens assembly to get their carbon price policy accepted.
The Greens got Labor to get rid of that mechanism and argued speed in passing the legislation was needed.
Funny that. The Greens wanted faster action but are accused of not allowing enough time and that’s why the Labor campaign failed.
“Yeah, the adoption of Green policy by Gillard precipitated her political destruction. Never Again!”
***
Nah, you’d be thinking of your old mates The Faceless Men.
Labor only have themselves to blame for destroying two prime ministers from their own side in one go.
Oh my poor little sister. Having her second zoom meeting with Peter Dutton in 2 days.
Non @ #213 Tuesday, November 24th, 2020 – 2:24 pm
The fossil fuel union puppets and the self-promoters were never going to have a Labor-Green-Indy Govt.
Yes, I agree, FF. Rudd failed. Gillard failed. The attempts to deal with first Turnbull and then Brown also resulted in failure. Labor made itself hostage to its opponents and paid the price. The result is in the numbers. Labor now lack the plurality required to win again. This is the political landscape across which we all must traverse.
Labor won a Federal election in 1929 from Opposition. They did not win again from Opposition until 1972…an interval of 43 years. Labor won from Opposition in 2007. They may not win again from Opposition until 2050. I think they will not win again until all those who want to bring and end to LNP rule can combine their efforts instead of trying to stymie each other. Effectively, this means will not see another federal Labor Government for many decades, if at all. Federal Labor is much, much weaker now than at any time since its formation. Nothing of any significance has been durably resolved on terms favourable to working people since before 1996. Nothing will be.
Guytaur your way of dismissing others ‘with your opinion’ stops discussion.
What I do not agree with is your lack of nuance and lack of acceptance of others points of view.
Put simply I put forward evidence not opinion that you would not acknowledge and then you get nasty.
I am all for discussion that tries to change Labor policy on climate change as I believe it needs changing. But what you have done is reminded me why I used to vote Green and never will again……the self righeousness in the guise of a ‘opinion’.
There are posts of yours on here that I fully support where you suggest changes that could be made. Then it gets to this – I am sure I am not the only one who feels this way.
This discussion leaves a bad taste and makes me realise why I do not post on here regularly it gets toxic.
The FACT is they voted down the CPRS and you will not acknowledge that, it is not scapegoating the Greens – they have it on there own website.
Your use of whining is not restraint, it is a cheap way of dismissing someone.
I to have been around with this discussion for over 10 years and would hope I would treat others like I would expect to be treated.
Get back to practical solutions and stop with cheap shots, if you read back through my posts you will see I acknowledge your posting and was curious why others react to it. Spose I know now, you post a lot but then resort to playing the man.
Note how Briefly always uses the Menzies era to argue Labor doesn’t win from opposition.
My advice. Look at why Labor failed in those long years and make sure Labor never repeats those failures.
Instead look at the success from formation of the Labor party till today.
It’s a very different story than the one Briefly wants to paint.
Labor wins when it’s strongly progressive.
Rex Douglas says:
Tuesday, November 24, 2020 at 2:32 pm
Non @ #213 Tuesday, November 24th, 2020 – 2:24 pm
Yeah, the adoption of Green policy by Gillard precipitated her political destruction. Never Again!
The fossil fuel union puppets and the self-promoters were never going to have a Labor-Green-Indy Govt.
The Green campaign against the material interests of working people continues. We are fucked up by this. Entirely. The Greens will continue to drive working people into supporting to the LNP. So it goes. There is no end to this. Trumpism is alive and well in the Green House.
Scout
You brought up Rudd’s CPRS.
Totally irrelevant except as justification for whinging.
That may hurt your feelings but it’s the truth.
I tried the approach you are talking about for a long time by using polite words like myth making.
The brutal truth is the Labor party has been on a ten year whinge fest blaming the Greens for Labor’s campaign failure.
Labor will never be a progressive party while the fossil fuel interests control the policy agenda.
Vale Alan Ramsey. We could do with more of him about now.
Does anyone here know if Trump has any remaining election related lawsuits?
Rex
So we’re a progressive party, by that definition.
guytaur says:
Tuesday, November 24, 2020 at 2:40 pm
Note how Briefly always uses the Menzies era to argue Labor doesn’t win from opposition.
Australian political history has already been written, despite the efforts of g. to re-write it. Labor was kept from office by splits in the plurality in the 1930s, 50’s and 60s. It is split once again. The Brown split has been the most durable so far. These facts about the Australian political order cannot be dismissed. This reflects – they describe and define – the lived reality for voters. The splitters will go on splitting. The LNP will go on winning.
“Labor was using the mechanism of a citizens assembly to get their carbon price policy accepted.
The Greens got rid of that mechanism and argued speed in passing the legislation was needed.
Funny that. The Greens wanted faster action but are accused of not allowing enough time and that’s why the Labor campaign failed.”
***
My point was that it was actually the Greens that took the policy of the ETS to the 2010 Election. Labor had dumped the failed CPRS before the election and instead ran with the Citizens Assembly. Then when we got into minority gov, we were then able to get them to dump the talk-fest as well and get on with the job of implementing the ETS. It was a great outcome for Australia.
Rex Douglas
“Labor will never be a progressive party while the fossil fuel interests control the policy agenda”
Any evidence of that, or is it just something you made up?
Is it not Labor embracing renewable energy?
Does Labor have any plans for new coal fired power stations, or gas ones for that matter.
Does Labor have any plans for carbon capture?
bc
Vale Alan Ramsey indeed.
Until three years ago, he was also the husband of Laura Tingle.
Firefox
A great outcome that was to the credit of all involved in getting it passed.
It’s why I know there is something wrong with the Labor party people.
They treat their success as a shameful event.
Cud Chewer:
Pennsylvania is expected to certify its results showing Biden as the victor as soon as Monday. Trump has shown no signs of plans to concede once the results are certified and the lawsuits dwindle, however.
Firefox
Where is the ETS now? Its ‘implemetation’ had a half-life shorter than tennessine.
Kakaru
Labor is to blame for that in surrendering not fighting.
Learn from Covid 19. Reality trumps the lies.
Holdenhillbilly @ #231 Tuesday, November 24th, 2020 – 2:52 pm
They’ll do the cold-blooded thing to Trump eventually. Cancel his White House Access. 🙂
The ETS was terminated/managed out by the cross-party parliamentary fossil fuel cartel.
Goes away to golf. Comes back to find the locks have been changed and his stuff is on the lawn. Metaphorically speaking. 🙂
“Labor won a Federal election in 1929 from Opposition. They did not win again from Opposition until 1972…an interval of 43 years. Labor won from Opposition in 2007. They may not win again from Opposition until 2050. I think they will not win again until all those who want to bring and end to LNP rule can combine their efforts instead of trying to stymie each other. Effectively, this means will not see another federal Labor Government for many decades, if at all. Federal Labor is much, much weaker now than at any time since its formation. Nothing of any significance has been durably resolved on terms favourable to working people since before 1996. Nothing will be.”
***
TLDR; “We’re all fucked in Lib-kin garden.”
Holdenhillbilly @ #232 Tuesday, November 24th, 2020 – 1:52 pm
Their Monday is basically over now. Michigan certified. Haven’t heard anything about PA.
Scout,
Good to see you stuck around. Even if only to try the ultimately fruitless pursuit of trying to talk sense to guytaur. 🙂
“Where is the ETS now? Its ‘implemetation’ had a half-life shorter than tennessine.”
***
As you know, Abbott the wrecker dumped it after Labor spent three long years at war with themselves and gifted him power on a silver platter.
Yes Guytaur I brought it up with the right intentions that you dismissed the evidence after being called out for being wrong, and showed immaturity that I did not realise you had.
Don’t be patronising- I do not care what you think about ‘my feelings’ as you are set in your ways and out to have a crack not discuss. You have no idea who I am or my beliefs, I work in the community sector and deal with people set in their ways who have suffered trauma I have understanding for them it is the others in the system I find frustrating. I was honestly reaching out for discussion and you dismiss it with smart arse responses.
I was trying to move on from that discussion but you bring the tone down, no surprise you get people not wanting to engage with you.
Your feelings may have been hurt by others dismissing you and getting agressive with you – I was not I was defending you and trying to have a discussion. The context of other posters responses is now clearer to me. I came in peace I now leave.
Said before I’m out of here, will do so now. Back to work and pick up kid.
Peace to you and others.
Kakuru says Tuesday, November 24, 2020 at 2:50 pm
They separated in 2012, at least according to Wikipedia. Then again Laura Tingle’s Wikipedia page states that she has been dating Sam Neill since 2017, while Neill’s page states that they started dating in 2018.
Firefox says:
Tuesday, November 24, 2020 at 2:48 pm
“Labor was using the mechanism of a citizens assembly to get their carbon price policy accepted.
The Greens got rid of that mechanism and argued speed in passing the legislation was needed.
Funny that. The Greens wanted faster action but are accused of not allowing enough time and that’s why the Labor campaign failed.”
***
My point was that it was actually the Greens that took the policy of the ETS to the 2010 Election. Labor had dumped the failed CPRS before the election and instead ran with the Citizens Assembly. Then when we got into minority gov, we were then able to get them to dump the talk-fest as well and get on with the job of implementing the ETS. It was a great outcome for Australia.
It was an outcome that did not endure. Very little remains of the legislative package enacted by Gillard. The ongoing split in the plurality means nothing will be enacted in the Federal parliament to replace that which was repealed by Abbott. This is basically set in stone. Abbott won. His rise was enabled by Brown. We are still paying the price. We will continue to do so.
Politicians in the southern and western states of Australia are trying to move the country to a sustainable and environmentally clean way of life but are being held by the NSW/Qld fossil fuel dead weights.
Scout
You are in denial.
You bring up the irrelevant Rudd CPRS as most Labor people do.
Why? So you can whinge about the Greens because Labor lost the campaign.
The facts of the Greens being practical in supporting Labor passing the carbon price is just that. Fact.
Rudd’s CPRS is irrelevant.
“A great outcome that was to the credit of all involved in getting it passed.
It’s why I know there is something wrong with the Labor party people.
They treat their success as a shameful event.”
***
Absolutely. It’s amazing how many Laborites cannot bring themselves to celebrate the achievements of the Bandt/Gillard gov because of their hatred of the Greens. It’s the same with the long running and highly successful ACT Green/Labor gov – they couldn’t even bring themselves to celebrate on election night because of how well the Greens went.
bc
Yes indeed re Ramsey. Was amazed to see how long ago he had retired. Seemed much more recent. If only we could dial up a dozen more of him . 🙁
The Gillard-Brown deal will be remembered as a shameful episode in Labor history. It should never have happened.
The Secret Service has reportedly started to prepare for providing protection to President Trump, who still hasn’t conceded the 2020 election, after he leaves the White House in January.
Secret Service agents who work in Trump’s detail “are being asked whether they’re interested in transferring to Palm Beach, Florida,” in a “clear sign” that Trump’s “post-presidency life is taking shape,” ABC News reports. Additionally, the Secret Service has reportedly been looking at “physical reinforcements” to Trump’s Mar-a-Lago club.
The report notes that these are unofficial moves by the Secret Service because Trump has not yet conceded the election to President-elect Joe Biden, and a Secret Service spokesperson only told ABC that the agency doesn’t discuss the “means, methods or resources we utilize to carry out our protective mission.”
Meanwhile, ABC also reports that renovations to living quarters at Mar-a-Lago that are “expected to be occupied” by the president and by first lady Melania Trump after they leave the White House are underway, although Trump is also reportedly expected to spend time in New York and at his New Jersey golf club.