In the absence of anything else to report:
• Former Northern Territory Chief Minister Michael Gunner formally retired from parliament on Wednesday, having relinquished the leadership in May in the wake of a heart attack. In contrast to its counterparts in Western Australia, who have still not fired the starter’s gun on a by-election for North West Central, the government has already announced August 20 as the date for the by-election in his Darwin seat in Fannie Bay, which he retained by 9.6% at the 2020 election.
• Labor’s five members of the Joint Standing Committee on Electoral Matters are Jagajaga MP Kate Thwaites, Hawke MP Sam Rae, Blair MP Shayne Neumann and South Australian Senators Karen Grogan and Marielle Smith, one of whom will be the committee’s chair. There were four opposition members and one from the Greens in the previous parliament, but I’m unclear as to how that will play out this time.
• The report of Operation Watts, the joint inquiry by Victoria’s Independent Broad-based Anti-Corruption Commission and Ombudsman into certain Labor state parliamentarians’ branch-stacking activities, offers a wealth of invaluable detail on the hard realities of the operation of modern political parties.
Dr John says:
Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 3:30 pm
and of course Mick Gatto’s phone number rests in my desk drawer.
__________
I might be worried if it was the 1990s.
https://twitter.com/SenatorThorpe/status/1553254954735120384
I’m with Lidia ..!
C@tmommasays:
Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 7:42 am
Good morning and thank you, BK.
Feeling a bit crusty this morning, having gone to pick up my inebriated son from his best mate’s birthday party at midnight last night. Didn’t get home till 1am. Yoiks!
_____________________
I watched the footy then went to bed.
Rex
I’d like to see more unequivocal support for the referendum.
Her language is very similar to the Liberals still.
zoomster @ #104 Saturday, July 30th, 2022 – 3:58 pm
Except she’s genuine.
Rex
So she’s genuinely supporting what the Liberals are saying? That’s even more worrying.
zoomster @ #106 Saturday, July 30th, 2022 – 4:01 pm
Wouldn’t matter what she said, you just hate the Greens.
Mavissays:
Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 3:38 pm
Themunz:
Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 3:00 pm
“[‘Solar, wind and batteries is how to achieve it.’]
I don’t doubt that but how is, say, a pensioner going to be able to afford the new electricity prices? Many have difficulty with the existing rates. And looking at it in macro-economic terms, the new rate will fuel inflation.”
Welfare/pensioners should be helped as government is responsible for their plight. The hit to inflation can not be avoided but the answer is still replace fossil fuel energy with SWB as quickly as we can.
Rex Douglas says:
Wouldn’t matter what she said, you just hate the Greens.
_____
And especially Lidia Thorpe.
No, I’m very very committed to the Uluru Statement from the Heart and recognise that without unequivocal support it will be very difficult to deliver it.
My criticism of Thorpe has been in this context.
It would be extremely easy for the Greens to put their support beyond any doubt. They are still dancing around it.
Thorpe makes a good point re the UN declaration on the rights of the indigenous people being put to parliament on Monday, but to Labor partisans it’s all about the evil Greens.
*Enjoy these Witty Truisms*
1.Today a man knocked on my door and asked for a small donation towards the local swimming pool, so I gave him a glass of water.
2. I changed my password to “incorrect” so whenever I forget it the computer will say, “Your password is incorrect.”
3.Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity.
4.I’m great at multi-tasking. I can waste time, be unproductive, and procrastinate all at once.
5.If you can smile when things go wrong, you have someone in mind to blame.
6.Doesn’t expecting the unexpected mean that the unexpected is actually expected?
7.Take my advice — I’m not using it.
8.Hospitality is the art of making guests feel like they’re at home when you wish they were.
9.Television may insult your intelligence, but nothing rubs it in like a computer.
10. I bought a vacuum cleaner six months ago and so far all it’s been doing is gathering dust.
11.Every time someone comes up with a foolproof solution, along comes a more-talented fool.
12.If you keep your feet firmly on the ground, you’ll have trouble putting on your pants.
13.A computer once beat me at chess, but it was no match for me at kick boxing.
14.Ever stop to think and forget to start again?
*15.When I married Ms. Right, I had no idea her first name was Always.*
16.My wife got 8 out 10 on her driver’s test. The other two guys managed to jump out of her way.
17.There may be no excuse for laziness, but I’m still looking.
18.Women spend more time wondering what men are thinking than men spend thinking.
19.Give me ambiguity or give me something else.
20.He who laughs last thinks slowest.
21.Is it wrong that only one company makes the game Monopoly?
22.Women sometimes make fools of men, but most guys are the do-it-yourself type.
23.I was going to give him a nasty look, but he already had one.
24.Change is inevitable, except from a vending machine.
25.The grass may be greener on the other side but at least you don’t have to mow it…
Thank goodness Labor mp’s seem to be more engaging with Greens mp’s than Labor partisan supporters are.
Oh dear. The mob that loves to attack zoomster are at it again.
I think they need to honestly answer a question. Why do you support the position of Lidia Thorpe and not that of the other Indigenous MPs in the federal parliament? Is it because you think her perspective is the only one? The right one? You do remember that she was expelled by her own people from the Uluru Statement From the Heart process because they saw her as simply an attention-seeking troublemaker. That’s the Indigenous Australian you are going to the mat for? Your choice I guess.
I mean, you can bring up all her arguments as if they are the only ones, but at the end of the day YOU aren’t supporting the vast majority of Indigenous Australians wrt this process. Are you comfortable with that?
Why should the government negotiate with other parties when the Aboriginal community has expressly stated their wishes?
Surely if there is any negotiation to be done it is with those who made the Statement.
Rex Douglas @ #105 Saturday, July 30th, 2022 – 3:59 pm
How is she more genuine than other Indigenous Australians with a different perspective to hers?
C@tmomma says:
Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 4:19 pm
I think they need to honestly answer a question. Why do you support the position of Lidia Thorpe and not that of the other Indigenous MPs in the federal parliament? Is it because you think her perspective is the only one? The right one? You do remember that she was expelled by her own people from the Uluru Statement From the Heart process because they saw her as simply an attention-seeking troublemaker.
____________________
I don’t necessarily agree with her but I respect her opinion and don’t pile on hate. Like claiming she was ‘expelled by her own people’ when she actually just walked out, and calling her an ‘attention seeking trouble maker’.
nath
‘ Like suggesting she was ‘expelled by her own people’ when she actually just walked out..’
The facts are disputed. Thorpe says she walked out, elders who were present say she was booted.
zoomster says:
Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 4:30 pm
nath
‘ Like suggesting she was ‘expelled by her own people’ when she actually just walked out..’
The facts are disputed. Thorpe says she walked out, elders who were present say she was booted.
__________
I’ve never seen it reported that she was ‘booted’. I do recall reports that she was part of a group of delegates that walked out together, including a prominent Sydney Indigenous leader. Were they all thrown out? Where is the evidence for it?
Walked out/booted, doesn’t really matter, coz she’s a Green and Greens are BAAAD ..!
Claiming that she was ‘booted’ by ‘her own people’ is a fairly despicable form of character assassination if there is no reporting of that occurring:
Of the 250 delegates who met in 2017, seven walked out in protest. They were joined by 30 supporters in their walk-out protest.
Some, however, argue these numbers are conservative because others walked out who didn’t note their details on the day.
https://sydneysentinel.com.au/2022/07/the-aboriginal-people-who-oppose-the-uluru-statement-from-the-heart/
Giving advice to Parliament rather than to the Executive is quite critical.
Existing Indigenous advisory committees give their advice to the Executive.
The committee is essentially selected by the minister.
‘The Executive’ in practice is a minister – usually a relatively junior minister.
The deliberations are in camera.
Any reports or recommendations are not subject to parliamentary scrutiny.
Communicating with the Parliament implies that the communication is with all the Australian people. There will be no hiding from the reports or the recommendations. There will be little scope for a minister to suppress or massage unwelcome truths.
nath and Rex,
So 7 out of 250 suggests that their position represented less than 3% of the delegates present.
So the WA Libs are voting on pre-selection reforms. The article notes the national luminaries present and their key points. Let me save you some reading, literally, they’ve got nothing new, no change, just more of the same. Essentially, the voters got it wrong.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-07-30/liberals-major-reform-state-party-conference-perth/101285068
Certainly Professor Dominic O’Sullivan in his book covering the issue ‘Sharing the Sovereign: Indigenous Peoples, Recognition, Treaties and the State’ calls it a ‘walkout’. Where can this report of a ‘booting’ be found?
Sharing the Sovereign: Indigenous Peoples, Recognition, Treaties …
books.google.com.au › books
Seven of the 250 delegates, including the Victorian Green party Member of Parliament Lidia Thorpe ‘walked out’ of the Uluru deliberations arguing that …
Saying that the mob is heterogeneous is like saying all whites are British
When Noel Pearson supported the NT intervention someone remarked that Cape York peoples don’t like Arnhem Land mob
Thanks for the link C@tmomma.
https://youtu.be/JS3YJN3WED4
It wasn’t that long ago.
I’ve read a bit about Lidia Thorpe and from my reading of a few of her interviews it very much seems like she doesn’t really have a solution to square the circle with regards to the fact that Australia is a colonial invention that exists and that she exists inside of.
She wants a treaty before a voice, because she wants Aboriginals to be able to have sovereignty. But that sort of hints at them being apart from Australia? but not?
From my view, it would seem that creating a voice would do more than a treaty in effect because it’s Australia creating a space to expand representation. Treaties take a very long time to create, as she admits. And this is progress we can all have, probably have very soon if we try just a little.
Is this the a greens thing of the perfect being the enemy of the good?
“Communicating with the Parliament implies that the communication is with all the Australian people.”
I hadn’t considered that. Thanks BW. That’s a really good point.
On the numbers, Thorpe represents around 2% of Indigenous people. In the Noise stakes, Thorpe does the usual Greens thing: she inverts reality.
https://www.sbs.com.au/nitv/living-black/article/2022/04/25/heart-my-sleeve-senator-lidia-thorpe-will-never-back-down-1
Treaty first makes sense.
Rex,
Less than 3% of delegates at Uluru agree with you.
Seems Australia still has a ways to go on the LQBTQ+ issue. There’s still way too much hate out there that needs to be called out and shut down.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-07-30/shrine-of-remembrance-in-rainbow-colour-scrapped/101284904
“Saying that the mob is heterogeneous is like saying all whites are British
When Noel Pearson supported the NT intervention someone remarked that Cape York peoples don’t like Arnhem Land mob”
Noel Pearson is one person – the Uluru Statement is presented as the consensus view of the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander communities.
If it is the consensus – their wishes presented to the Australian people – then we should implement those wishes.
What’s the alternative?
Greens BAAD .. Greens EVIL .. Greens just trouble makers !!
OTOH, if Thorpe represents the Greens then she represents 12% of all Australians.
But do most Greens voters subscribe to the illogical, divisive and subversive approach by Bandt to the Statement?
Is the tail wagging the dog?
One very difficult problem for Indigenous leaders like Thorpe, Price, Pearson and Wyatt is that they may be abused by third parties who are running quite different agendas. This can and does happen on both extremes of Left and Right.
It took some time but I see that Rex has finally woken up about the Greens.
nath @ #125 Saturday, July 30th, 2022 – 4:45 pm
She wasn’t getting her way so she and others walked out.
She supports this. Do you, nath?
Aboriginal Embassy Statement from the Sacred Fire
WALKOUT STATEMENT
Opposing Constitutional Recognition and Manufactured Consent
Statement read by
Les Coe (Wiradjuri), Nioka Coe (Wiradjuri) and Ruth Gilbert (Wiradjuri).
at the Sacred Fire, Aboriginal Embassy Canberra, on 6.7.2017
We, the First Nations People who gathered at the Sacred Fire of the Aboriginal Embassy on 24-25 June 2017, reject the ‘Uluru Statement from the Heart’ and its’ Guiding Principles.
The ‘Uluru Statement’ is a reflection of the corrupt proceedings of the Referendum Council’s Regional Dialogues and the National Constitutional Convention, held at the Ayers Rock Resort near Uluru, Northern Territory, from 23-26 May 2017.
We assert that all First Nations have retained Law, language, land, culture, governance and the ability to enter into international relations on this island continent now known as Australia. Our Law continues to be the continental common law of the land. We live under the duress of a cold war of attrition and continuing genocide perpetrated by the Commonwealth of Australia, governing in right of the Crown of the United Kingdom.
We oppose the power of the British colonial Commonwealth of Australia who continues to illegally occupy our lands, territories, waters and airways.
We are aware that the United Nations understands Australia’s illegal status as a UN Member State and has instructed the Australian Government to decolonise from Britain. However, our First Nations pre-existing and continuing sovereignty is blocking them, as confirmed in 2010 by the UN Committee for the Elimination of Racial Discrimination (CERD). CERD advised the Australian government of the need to reset its relationship with First Nations by way of Treaty/ies.
We assert that the Commonwealth, State and Territory Constitutions do not have a constitutional head of power to pass any laws which affect, impact, or diminish the continental Sovereignty of First Nations and Peoples. This is the reason why the Commonwealth, via the Prime Minister and Cabinet’s Referendum Council, is so intent to coerce our people and manufacture consent for the colonial power to govern First Nations Peoples in right of the Crown of the United Kingdom.
The great First Nations chant of ‘Sovereignty Never Ceded’ is being challenged and betrayed by treasonous agents of the coloniser. It is being orchestrated behind the scenes by puppeteers, including but not limited to, the Co-Chair of the Referendum Council, Mark Leibler, who supports military occupation.
We are not Australian citizens. We are outside of the Australian constitution as ‘aliens’ to its governance. At present, the Commonwealth Government of Australia allegedly acquired the right, by way of the 1967 constitutional referendum, to pass ‘special measure’ laws for Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Peoples as an alien race, outside of the Australian citizenry, by evoking the race power of Section 51 Subsection 26.
We demand that the Commonwealth government desist from its deceitful intent to usurp our sovereignty through a war of stealth, by resetting the invaders’ relationship with Sovereign First Nations, without identifying the terms of its agenda. This is both immoral and unethical. It is indeed an act of war, being publicly spun as a ‘well overdue obligation’ on the part of the invader state to incorporate the invaded Sovereign First Nations’ inhabitants into Australia’s colonial Constitution.
In this way, the Commonwealth will create a specific head of power to pass laws with respect to Sovereign First Nations and assimilate our people into the invader’s constitution by the acquiescence and/or surrender of our inherent sovereign rights, which clears the pathway for Australia to decolonise from the Crown of the United Kingdom.
Only one pathway for the referendum was argued by the National Constitutional Convention: that of First Nations’ inclusion in the Constitution. All other options were gagged. Wrong way legal advice was endorsed by the Referendum Council to fool our people into believing that inclusion into the constitution would not impact on our inherent pre-existing Sovereign rights. Also, to have a ‘Voice’ and a ‘national advisory organisation’ does not require a referendum.
No genuine mandate to make decisions on behalf of First Nations belonged to the majority of participants at the National Constitutional Convention. The 12 Regional Dialogues were closed invitation-only meetings, from which 10 ‘delegates’ were ‘elected’ to make up 60% of the ‘delegates’ at the Convention. Once the Referendum Council and its organisers, the Australian Institute of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islanders Studies (AIATSIS), realised they had lost the numbers for constitutional inclusion, an executive decision was made by the powers that be to stack the National Constitutional Convention with their paid staff and facilitators, whom they called ‘delegates’. This created a major conflict of interest.
Additionally, 20% of the participants at the Convention came from organisations, which had already been held to ransom to promote the agenda of the Recognise campaign and the Referendum Council in order to continue receiving government funding. A further 20% were individuals selected by government as ‘delegates’.
The Referendum Council refused all recording of the National Constitution Convention to maintain the veil of secrecy, in order to protect Point 10 of the Guiding Principles to the ‘Uluru Statement’, which states: ‘Does not interfere with current and future legal arrangements.’ In this sentence, the treasonous compromise to maintain the status quo is spelt out clearly.
The proposed Makarrata agreement-making is about domestic contracts, which will keep First Nations under a colonial constitution’s head of power. The deep meaning of Makarrata is misunderstood as it is a complex and high-level ceremony, which can result in the death of the guilty party and/or blood-letting, and is designed to restore social harmony once the wrong has been dealt with. In the 1980s the Makarrata terminology was strongly rejected by Central Desert communities during the National Aboriginal Conference (NAC) Treaty consultation process.
We support the demand for ‘Truth Before Treaty/Treaties’ in a Truth and Justice process, which exposes the crimes perpetrated by the past and ongoing genocide and gross violations of Human Rights of First Nations Peoples in Australia. This will confirm the British and Australians have, and are, benefitting from the proceeds of horrendous crimes against the innocent.
We are developing agreements between families and clans, which lead to Sovereign Treaties between First Nations that are independent from the illegal occupying colonial power ruling in right of the Crown of the United Kingdom.
Turning the ‘Aboriginal Embassy into stone’ is the worst form of appropriation of the spearhead of the Sovereignty Movement. The Aboriginal Embassy maintains the resistance to the invading power.
We call on all Sovereign First Nations Peoples across the Country to engage with the mainstream public to establish a national process, which culminates in the rewriting of a new and modern constitution for a Republic. This must be underpinned by First Nations Sovereignty of the ancient continental common Law established by Tjurkurpa, Goomarra, also known as the Law of Natural Creation.
We Respect the Rights of Mother Earth as fundamentally integral to the wellbeing of humanity.
Statement was prepared at the Sacred Fire, Aboriginal Embassy, Canberra, by the Walkout Collective – the First Nations representatives who walked out from the National Constitutional Convention in protest on 24 May 2017, and participants of the First Nations Rise Up meeting held at the Aboriginal Embassy on 24-25 June 2017.
https://nationalunitygovernment.org/content/walkout-statement-aboriginal-embassy-statement-sacred-fire
Just so we know what side you are on, nath, and what you are supporting. 😐
Still can’t find any reporting of Thorpe being ‘booted’ by ‘her own people’ from the convention. Seems like an egregious lie put about by Thorpe haters in furtherance of creating a reputation of her being a ‘trouble maker’.
Rex Douglas @ #135 Saturday, July 30th, 2022 – 5:00 pm
Do you even know what you are supporting?
So if the greens have a member who openly campaigns against the voice, then what?
Progress leads to progress, and likewise failure often leads to much more failure. If the voice fails, then I expect no government will touch this sort of change for a long while.
“When did our old people march down the street saying, ‘Let’s go into the Aussie Constitution.’ I’ve never heard a rally say that, but I’ve heard them say ‘Treaty.’”
Hmm:
* Is someone listening when they refuse to hear the people who wrote the Voice from the Heart?
* Is a Treaty incompatible with a Voice to Parliament?
* Is someone who “never backs down” actually negotiating?
I try to repress my inner cynic, but it’s telling me that one possibility here is that the Greens are searching for something that differentiates them from Labor. If so, then shame on them for using this issue. It’s no better than taking a hostage. The voice to parliament hurts absolutely no-one.
nath @ #140 Saturday, July 30th, 2022 – 5:06 pm
As my revised statement says, she walked out. You win one small point, nath. Now, answer my question. Are you a supporter of the aims of Lidia Thorpe and the people in the Indigenous community with like-minded views?
Farmers want money to control feral animals because they are potential vectors for FMD. Start with the Kusciusko Barilaro feral horse herd!
Late Riser @ #143 Saturday, July 30th, 2022 – 5:10 pm
If you read the letter that The Uluru Statement From the Heart refuseniks wrote, you’ll see that it has a lot in common with the Sovereign Citizen Movement. Which is why the Aboriginal Tent Embassy in Canberra was so easily co-opted by them during the pandemic. They cede no legal rights to the Commonwealth of Australia. Which makes you wonder why Lidia Thorpe agrees to be a Senator even. She talks it but she doesn’t walk it, at the end of the day.
Poroti…@1.14 pm….
Your British Gas post reminded me of a story I heard – some years ago now – when an executive was as to explain why his annual salary computed out to 4,000 pounds a day…..
His questioner wanted to know what he did to be worth 4 grand of British pounds at the time…
Of course, he could not.
His response was…”Well, it’s what people like me get paid…………………….
Similar to the CEO of Easy Jet few years ago, on two or three million a year, getting bonus when she was calling for “great productivity ” from cabin crew (read, work more for the same or less) who then claimed she was ‘worth’ what Easy Jet paid her..
I don’t get involved in disagreements between Indigenous peoples about Indigenous issues. I hope it all gets sorted amicably. My interest in the issue extends only to the remarkable vitriol and hatred that Lidia Thorpe seems to kindle in certain people, noting that she seems to be the recipient of a considerable number of death threats.
The Coalition have indicated qualified support for the Voice. They want to see more detail on how it would work.
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/live/2022/jul/30/australia-news-live-anthony-albanese-indigenous-voice-garma-festival-covid-cases-deaths-hospitals-surge?filterKeyEvents=false&page=with:block-62e49e008f08730a1f7f4118#block-62e49e008f08730a1f7f4118
nath @ #148 Saturday, July 30th, 2022 – 5:23 pm
Adam Goodes copped it too.