The latest of Essential Research’s fortnightly polls, which continue to limit themselves to issue questions in the wake of the great pollster failure, focuses mostly on the Israel Folau controversy. Respondents registered high levels of recognition of the matter, with 22% saying they had been following it closely, 46% that they had “read or seen some news”, and another 17% saying they were at least “aware”.
Probing further, the poll records very strong support for what seem at first blush to be some rather illiberal propositions, including 64% agreement with the notion that people “should not be allowed to argue religious freedom to abuse others”. However, question wording would seem to be very important here, as other questions find an even split on whether Folau “has the right to voice his religious views, regardless of the hurt it could cause others” (34% agree, 36% disagree), and whether there should be “stronger laws to protect people who express their religious views in public” (38% agree, 38% disagree). Furthermore, 58% agreed that “employers should not have the right to dictate what their employees say outside work”, which would seem to encompass the Folau situation.
Respondents were also asked who would benefit and suffer from the federal government’s policies over the next three years, which, typically for a Coalition government, found large companies and corporations expected to do best (54% good, 11% bad). Other results were fairly evenly balanced, the most negative findings relating to the environment (26% good, 33% bad) and, funnily enough, “older Australians” (26% good, 38% bad). The economy came in at 33% good and 29% bad, and “Australia in general” at 36% good and 27% bad. The poll was conducted last Tuesday to Saturday from a sample of 1099.
Also of note:
• A referendum on indigenous recognition may be held before the next election, after Aboriginal Affairs Minister Ken Wyatt’s announcement on Wednesday that he would pursue a consensus option for a proposal to go before voters “during the current parliamentary term”. It is clear the government would not be willing to countenance anything that went further than recognition, contrary to the Uluru Statement from the Heart’s call for a “First Nations Voice enshrined in the Constitution” – a notion derided as a “third chamber of parliament” by critics, including Scott Morrison.
• A paper in the University of Western Australia Law Review keeps the Section 44 pot astir by suggesting 26 current members of federal parliament may fall foul by maintaining a “right of abode” in the United Kingdom – a status allowing “practically the same rights” as citizenship even where citizenship has been formally renounced. The status has only been available to British citizens since 1983, but is maintained by citizens of Commonwealth countries who held it before that time, which they could do through marriage or descent. This could potentially be interpreted as among “the rights or privileges of a subject or citizen of a foreign power”, as per the disqualifying clause in Section 44. Anyone concerned by this has until the end of the month to challenge an election result within the 40 day period that began with the return of the writs on June 21. Action beyond that point would require referral by the House of Representatives or the Senate, as appropriate.
Slightly out of date, and doesnt include grandparents…..
‘37.4 million immigrant adults live in the US and born outside US. 19.7 million US born adults who have at least one immigrant parent’.
37.4+19.7 = 25% of the US adult population (2012).
https://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2013/02/07/second-generation-americans/
I am already dizzy from Trumps hypocrisy.
Trump’s message is more ‘America. Love it or leave it.’ than ‘boo immigrants’ .
America does have a problem with mass immigration of people that are often undocumented, the way its been managed is a serious problem but until there is a proper border and proper process in place then this issue will continue.
Make America the Same as it is?
Her Drumpf’s message is that people of colour had better STFU or he will put the cross hairs on them.
The dems were offering oodles of cash for such things – at borders and airports.
Trump just wants to play hate games for political gains. He is not looking for solutions. He is not looking to build a better US. It certainly has nothing to do with order at the border or order anywhere else – in fact, disorder plays into his school yard games of us vs them, a version of Jack Merridew only even more pathetic.
a r @ #1450 Monday, July 15th, 2019 – 2:22 pm
I don’t suppose it helps to say that they started it by completely trashing proper governance in Central America.
(edit – removal of irrelevance)
IMO the Dems are barking up the wrong tree.
Hundreds of thousands of people a month with back pressure of tens of millions more from central and south America is OTT.
Apart from anything else the border crossers provide a vast pool of exploitable labour that undercuts US workers.
Trump is onto a winner here, provided he manages to separate the hispanic voe from border crosser hate.
Give Trump a break. He only means those dirty African and Central American gringos. Not whities.
If Brown thinks that the global shift to renewables won’t cause massive problems for biodiversity he is barking up the wrong tree.
In the broad the trade off is between a massive extinction even without renewables or a minor extinction event with renewables.
There is simply no time or scale for the sort of local footsies that NIMBY Brown is playing.
As for what renewables look like, FMD.
Simon
No doubt Trump is up to his usual game playing but when I see the tragic case of the drowning of a father and his child, I’m left wondering why were they reduced to needing to cross a river, surely there has to be a better way of managing this. If someone wants to relocate from New York to LA, no one blinks, yet politicians cannot cope with someone wanting to move from Mexico to New Mexico. I’m the first to argue a country should control its borders but this while issue and it also applies to our own refugee issues seems beyond our politicians.
I expect Pence will do a few more cage inspections between now and 2020. If only they had smellovision.
Itzadream
Just like they started it in Iran by trashing proper governance there.
‘Mexicanbeemer says:
Monday, July 15, 2019 at 6:15 pm
Simon
No doubt Trump is up to his usual game playing but when I see the tragic case of the drowning of a father and his child, I’m left wondering why were they reduced to needing to cross a river, surely there has to be a better way of managing this. If someone wants to relocate from New York to LA, no one blinks, yet politicians cannot cope with someone wanting to move from Mexico to New Mexico. I’m the first to argue a country should control its borders but this while issue and it also applies to our own refugee issues seems beyond our politicians.’
Globally there are around 60-70 million displaced persons. The difference between 60-70 million DPs moving from New York to California and 60-70 million DPs moving from outside the US to inside the US is potentially rather large.
To date the scale is that around 11 million DPs/asylum seekers/refugees are inside the US. At the current rate that will double in well less than a decade.
ItzaDream says:
America does have a problem with mass immigration of people that are often undocumented, the way its been managed is a serious problem but until there is a proper border and proper process in place then this issue will continue.
I don’t suppose it helps to say that they started it by completely trashing proper governance in Central America.
———————————–
General comment
Its funny how anti-American crowd bring up these kind of excuses instead of addressing the issue and they seem to ignore the many countries with heavy American influence yet they are not basket cases.
I was driving along the Rio Grande having done a loop down from Phoenix, along Butch Cassidy country to Las Cruces, all stunningly beautiful, then up to Albuquerque and Santa Fe. I was stopped just outside Truth Or Consequences* (it exists) for a very close inspection of the car, and the trunk. For Mexicans.
(*named after a quiz show when it won the right to change its name to same)
Mexicanbeemer @ #1516 Monday, July 15th, 2019 – 6:19 pm
I think you’re confusing ‘excuse’ with ‘reason’.
I’m not makin’ no excuses for them.
Boerwar
These people don’t seem to be displaced or refugees, they seem to be would be migrants that want to move to America for a better life. Not that the label matters.
ItzaDream
The anti-American crowd use these issues an an opportunity to bring up all kinds of things America may have done, even things that happened decades ago.
Mexicanbeemer @ #1520 Monday, July 15th, 2019 – 6:25 pm
Many are fleeing for their lives.
https://www.amnestyusa.org/fleeing-for-our-lives-central-american-migrant-crisis/
Mexicanbeemer @ #1521 Monday, July 15th, 2019 – 6:27 pm
I’m really not sure what you mean, or where you are going with this.
MexicanBeemer
America is the author of its own misfortune in its dealings with Iran.
Mohammad Mossaddegh
‘Mexicanbeemer says:
Monday, July 15, 2019 at 6:25 pm
Boerwar
These people don’t seem to be displaced or refugees, they seem to be would be migrants that want to move to America for a better life.’
At least partly true, for sure. The scale, I don’t know. I suggest some sort of practically unsortable cline.
Your standard criminal murder rates seem to blend/overlap with your standard political murder rates in some Central American states. IMO it is arguable that any of the 4-5 million or so who have fled Venezuela could be either or both economic or political refugees.
Jolyon Wagg
I don’t agree with America’s Iran policies, they need to get over the late 1970s/early 1980s.
‘Jolyon Wagg says:
Monday, July 15, 2019 at 6:29 pm
MexicanBeemer
Its funny how anti-American crowd bring up these kind of excuses instead of addressing the issue and they seem to ignore the many countries with heavy American influence yet they are not basket cases.
America is the author of its own misfortune in its dealings with Iran.’
Partly true. At the same time the democracy hating, enlightenment hating, misogynist and murderous theocrats who are running Iran must take some accountability for, at least, their obvious political and military and religious ambitions and actions to control the Middle East.
@Mexicanbeemer
Americans involved in these displaced refugees only themselves to blame.
Through wars, interfering, economic sanctions etc
‘Zoidlord says:
Monday, July 15, 2019 at 6:32 pm
@Mexicanbeemer
Americans involved in these displaced refugees only themselves to blame.
Through wars, interfering, economic sanctions etc’
The notion that the self-destructive political behaviours of some Latin American states is ALL the fault of the US is absurd.
Well, I could start a conversation about the one way benefits of globalisation. How money can be sucked out of a country but the people must stay put (I wonder what Adam Smith would say). Or the injustices of world state based system where borders were drawn up by a few men and your life expectancy and options for success are completely down to where you are born wrt those lines.
Or the history of colonialism and neo-colonialsim and how devastating the effects were, how they ripped apart social, political and economic fabrics that still resonate deeply to this day (dont impudently swipe this away, just dont).
But they are all just words written by academics (mostly). When I see photos like the one you describe I remember my own travels in the third world and I feel those words and theories and arguments are, despite the well meaning, just a waste of time – that we are rushing away from Liberalism (in international relations) and headlong into a hunger games style dystopia.
Almost the very first sign of intelligent drought policy at any level for years:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-06-28/drought-report-queensland-frieght-subsidies-slashed-by-2021/11260042
@Monday, July 15, 2019 at 6:19 pm
If I do something good in one area and something bad in another area , then when all the people point at the bad thing I just go and point to the good thing and everything is all right?
The basic point is this “Has America contributed to it’s migrant problem by removing good governments?”
Zoidy
Most of the people seeking to enter the U.S are not refugees, and many of these people are not claiming refugee status, and from what i understand of it many of them seem to be Mexicans but there might be some from Venezuela but they are likely to be the sort of people Trump would like as they would be more likely to be right wing.
‘SK
Or the injustices of world state based system where borders were drawn up by a few men…’
Borders rarely reflect the random behaviour of isolated male individuals.
Most current borders were not drawn up by a few men. Where they WERE drawn up by a few men, those few men generally represented vast projections of political, social and military power.
I wonder how women would change the world’s borders, given the opportunity?
ItzaDream says:
I’m really not sure what you mean, or where you are going with this.
—————————————–
Whenever there is an issue impacting on one part of the world, certain people instead of addressing the issue, just focus their comments on whatever thing they think America did, sometimes it might be justified but many time its just tiresome and in some cases its not really America that caused the problem. A classic example is the middle east, America gets the blame for it all but in reality the real cause of many of the problems stems from Britain/France and their post WW1 map.
One of the greatest works in Western art is Wagner’s Ring Cycle. Yes, he had anti-semitic thoughts. Notwithstanding, it is an inspired work of genius whose central thesis is the men of power have fucked things up, bigly, and women are where the solution lies. Give the keys of the planet to women.
But Thatcher.
So many know alls with so little wisdom.
Bad board hogging. Sorry.
Later.
The Oz reports Newspoll will be back “very shortly”.
https://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/media/angry-ita-retires-from-talk/news-story/17494670c7508819992cff5a47e5c9b7
There are a lot of shitty countries near Mexico (Guatemala, El Salvador, Honduras etc) where thousands of people are disappeared every year. If you are going to flee that you might as well try to make it to the US via Mexico.
Historians have looked at women rulers and found they can be just as ready to go off fighting as the men were with historical evidence suggesting women’s influence is underestimated.
Boerwar
Agreed. My point is that the rise of the theocrats can be traced to the overthrow of the secular government of Mossadeq by the US and Great Britain.
It is a worry to see that sporting women are doing things that previously only boofhead male footballers would get up to… however, I’m not sure Roller Derby is a sport?
“A Melbourne woman sexually assaulted three of her roller derby teammates at an alcohol-fuelled party where people were dancing naked and playing kissing games in a hot tub.
Jennifer Peterson, 31, pleaded guilty in the County Court of Victoria on Monday to three charges of sexual assault on December 4, 2016.
The assaults occurred at another teammate’s Brunswick East home following a day spent drinking at the roller derby club’s Christmas party.
Peterson’s lawyer, prominent barrister Julian McMahon SC, described the party as a “highly sexualised environment saturated with alcohol”.
“It’s clear there was a lot of nudity and it was a very tactile event, lots of bodies squashing into spas, lots of people engaging in a range of conduct from dancing naked to games such as ‘truth, dare or pash’ and lots of people kissing each other,” he told the pre-sentencing hearing.
“It’s a very unusual event, I haven’t seen another case like it.”
He said his client has a “very hazy recollection of the night” as she was “obviously terribly drunk”.
https://www.canberratimes.com.au/story/6274805/roller-derby-party-hot-tub-sex-assaults/?cs=14231
Here’s one for Mavis.
The fabulous Maria Callas. Warning warning *opera alert*
https://www.youtube.com/watch?reload=9&v=J3_2bI27gl0
‘Jolyon Wagg says:
Monday, July 15, 2019 at 7:02 pm
Boerwar
Partly true. At the same time the democracy hating, enlightenment hating, misogynist and murderous theocrats who are running Iran must take some accountability for, at least, their obvious political and military and religious ambitions and actions to control the Middle East.
Agreed. My point is that the rise of the theocrats can be traced to the overthrow of the secular government of Mossadeq by the US and Great Britain.’
We are as one.
Nancy Pelosi needs to show some respect for these dynamic young Congresswomen. They are the future of the party and the nation.
sprocket at 7.07pm – Roller derby is as much a sport as speed skating. Though I’m pretty sure Steve Bradbury has never been accused of rotten behaviour like that pleaded to by this Jennifer Peterson person.
I’m assuming Toby Ralph is the people’s panelist.
Confessions @ #1549 Monday, July 15th, 2019 – 5:44 pm
I doubt it. Here’s an excerpt from his biography:
https://www.celebrityspeakers.com.au/toby-ralph/
Not exactly a “commoner”. Then again, none of them ever have been.