We’re about half-way between the weekly BludgerTrack and when I’m anticipating the next opinion poll, this being the period of pre-budget calm before the storm, and a new thread is wanted. So I’ve decided to hang this one off the latest ANUpoll survey, an exercise conducted by the Australian National University two or three times a year to gauge the public mood on a specific area of public policy, and track the salience of various issues over time. The subject of the latest instalment, which was conducted by phone from a sample of 1200 in February and March, is tax and equity in Australia. Among various findings on tax that would be familiar from those who follow Essential Research, the report also finds support for increased spending on social services at its highest level since the series began in 1987. The report also finds that, in spite of everything, 56% consider the existing system “moderately fair”, on top of another 4% for “very fair”, while 22% rate it “not too fair” and 18% “not at all fair”.
The survey also features regular questions in which respondents are asked to name the first and second most important political problems, out of a list that presently includes 27 options. To make this easier to interpret, I’ve condensed results into various categories, which are hopefully generally self-explanatory (particularly economy/budget, environment and better government – security/external covers wars, terrorism, defence and immigration, while services covers health and education and such). The progress of these results since 2008 is shown in the chart below.
From which a number of points are clearly worth noting. Concern about service provision mounted to giddy heights after the 2014 budget, but promptly returned to normal after Malcolm Turnbull became prime minister. The combined result for the various economic issues is at a low point in the latest survey, having peaked in the years immediately following the global financial crisis. Security/external and crime/society, which are largely conservative concerns, are on an upward trend. “Better government”, I’m guessing, was a popular response among Coalition supporters while Labor was in power, but is not a correspondingly popular choice for Labor voters now it’s the Coalition’s turn.
TPOF
I don’t know, I think I’d still rather help people who r in danger right now, ie in Syria complete destruction of towns, starving of people etc, beheadings, than someone from a country where it’s relatively safe but there may b incidence of persecution…..
Eg of an Iranian family coming to Australia as refugees because they were political activists: Senator Sam Dastyari’s parents!
cud @ 9.52
I disagree that Labor has announced policies because it wants to put the boat people issue into the background. I agree that they want to avoid the issue as much as possible this side of the election, but the policy announcements are about positioning Labor as the party to take Australia forward by addressing specific national problems which are crying out to be dealt with.
Which brings me to my second point. Labor’s policies are not really so bold, when compared to past Labor opposition policies. What makes them bold is the absolute lack of anything bold or imaginative from the Coalition. The idea of coming out with policies, such as negative gearing and capital gains tax windback, which are actually widely popular among swinging voters and having them labelled as bold shows just how fearful of scare campaigns our political parties have become and how the commentariat has come to accept that position as the status quo.
AB,
There is no orderly queue out there in the real world.
K17,
No, I’m not.
Couldn’t agree more Cud. Except we are not rational and don’t understand the huge implications of climate change for world peace and order. At best people think of it only in terms of rising sea levels at the margins of coastal Australia and slightly warmer weather all year round.
These “National Security Hotline” ads are an absolute disgrace! I think they are exactly the same version as those that appeared a decade ago. They are still trying to promote the same pathetic fear and scare-mongering. Trust no one, be afraid, anywhere, anytime, when you least expect it, they’ll strike. If in doubt point them out. Sadly, I fear many will fall for it. Who needs the police when we can police ourselves? Disgusting tactics.
C@tmomma @ #339 Saturday, April 30, 2016 at 10:05 pm
I couldn’t find any hard statistics about the exact numbers that Fraser brought in, but from Chifley to McMahon, there was a steady intake rate of immigrants (not refugees, in case that makes any difference). Whitlam pared the rate back for three years, until Fraser returned it to its pre-Whitlam position.
Seems to me the Greens policy is that we should welcome all asylum seekers, especially those who come by boats, because that somehow “purifies” or “ennobles” them as “more desperate” than the other lazy, layabout losers who are content to languish in UN camps living the ife Of Riley, next door to war zones.
The Greens reckon that because some people with a good case once came here in boats, decades ago, from Vietnam, that means everyone who comes here in a boat is automatically deserving of our uncritical welcome. It’s so much moreromantic than filling out a form, waiting for years and finally getting your chance after being vetted properly. Self-selection is soooo sexy.
So is money. The people who come here in boats have to money to do so. Last time I looked, having enough money to bribe a people smuggler is not an automatic qualification for citizenship, unless you’re a Green, when it literally becomes the only qualification.
Labor is trying to do something sensible about the people who are here already, or in Manus or Nauru. But the Greens insisting that we let them all out, and then let all their rellies into the country as well – as long as they “pass the test” by bribing people smugglers – is so crazy it’s hard to know where to start laughing.
What will really happen is what has always happened before. The wet, hearts-on-our-sleeves Greens approach will scare the majority of the Australian public so bad that they’ll insist – and will get – an even harsher regime for dealing with asylum seekers. If Labor can’t convince them that they’ll do this, then the Liberals will win by default. Again. Like they have always done.
The same goes for action on Climate Change.
There is nothing more dangerous than an ideologue – or either the left or the right. They are both destructive and counter-productive. by their insistence on scary, all-or-nothing-at-all outcomes they get what those outcomes deserve: nothing.
http://www.canberratimes.com.au/act-news/act-commits-to-100-per-cent-renewable-energy-target-by-2020-simon-corbell-20160428-goh1l9.html
Look it’s not an article on refugees.
Elites in the Western world (leaders, the wealthy, the educated) are the only ones in the world who do not believe in defending, promoting or advantaging the needs of their ethnicity (tribe).
The attitude has been deemed suicidal (and caucasian / anglo-saxon people are headed for demographic whiteout so there is a lot of truth to this).
The assumption of these Western elite is either that their power can survive demographic downfall, that other ethnicities, cultures and societies will be benevolent to them or that they will be dead by then anyway so what is the difference.
Chinese businesspeople look after China, and Chinese people. Indian’s look after Indian’s (if you’ve ever worked for an Indian company you will know this as a fact). Anglo’s have a dream where they can look after everybody / re: everybody lives in happiness and peace.
In ever province where Western / anglo power has been overturned it has not gone well for that demographic.
Do you think a future black/mexican majority USA will come to Australia’s aid when we need it? An ethnically overturned Europe?
Oh that’s right – you believe neither of those things can never happen.
Australia (the US and Europe) will always be anglo an even if that was not so, nothing would change. And nobody ever in history has ever invaded a weaker neighbour to take from them. And white/christian minorities are always treated well by others.
Fairyland.
Please explain to me how Europe, the USA or Australia will NOT flip their majority/minority statuses given the mathematics of immigration, current birthrates and birth rate trends?
Aww mathematics is inconvenient isn’t it – better stick with emotion.
K17 @ 10.04
Refugees are not necessarily poor. They may have amassed wealth but still be persecuted for reasons of race or religion. More typically, though, the money is paid by family outside the country of persecution, such as family in Australia, or by family elsewhere who are all persecuted but who can pull together enough money to send one family member to establish a home in a place where long term settlement is feasible.
Again, it should be remembered that real refugees need, like the rest of us, not just protection from immediate danger, but also a place where they can settle and bring up families. The problem with the refugee camps in places like Jordan and Turkey is that there is no long term future for them, only temporary asylum.
Many of the Vietnamese who came to Australia in the first wave of boat people in the Seventies did not come as whole families. Often some or all of family members were left behind, some in re-education camps or worse. They established lives in Australia and brought out what family members they could subsequently. And they contributed to Australia – by far the vast majority to the national benefit, but some becoming drug pushers and criminals (like the profile for the rest of the population).
Or better say it is racist to consider such things. That even if they are true it is racist and improper to do something about it so better let it pass, just let it happen. We are all people, it doesn’t matter if Whites become a persecuted minority.
Anyway won’t happen in my lifetime (just my kids and grandkids) so why care?
See suicidal.
Funny how making the right decisions to protect our kids and way of life is so important when it comes to the generational impacts of climate change…
Growing up in Oyster Bay I had a mate who was knocked of his bike and broke his leg.
near the primary school there was a shop that sold everything owned by a Greek named Mr Kaldos all the kids used to make jokes about him me included. While my mate was in hospital a regular visitor to him was Mr Kaldos who would take him treats comics etc. after that nobody made jokes about Mr Kaldos any mor
If American Indian’s and Australian Aborigines were handed back their countries (and all descendants of and recent immigrants went back to where they came from) what do you think their immigration policies would be?
Open door or closed door?
20,000 per year, 50,000 or 200,000?
People often say (and I absolutely agree) that these people have a lot of wisdom to share…
C@tmomma @ #352 Saturday, April 30, 2016 at 10:19 pm
Did they come on a boat? That is, were they trafficked or smuggled? Were they interned? Were they stripped of their legal rights? Were they held as political prisoners? If not, why not!
L G H, you should be posting you disgraceful race-baiting comments on Stormfront and not here.
Put a frog in very slowly warming water and it won’t leave it until it is cooked (thanks Al Gore).
Western elites won’t believe it is possible to suffer from immigration (or persecution) until it is listed upon them and then a la the frog, it is too late (or you have to fight like buggery…)
the trouble with climate refugees is that you have move them to bigger islands as their current one sinks into the briny deep.
I think another issue is that if u come from a non-western country basically anyone can be persecuted (or say they r). Gay – often illegal, vocal againts government – can get u jailed, military age man – forced service, woman – well just about any injustice (forced marriages, fgm, acid attacks, no rights to work, drive etc). So if u turn up in a boat how many can b proven not to b persecuted?
virtualkat @ #369 Saturday, April 30, 2016 at 10:42 pm
Considering 90% of asylum seekers are found to be refugees, I’d say 10%.
It is not race-baiting, it is the truth.
This is why our current attitudes are suicidal. We are unable to openly face the truth.
The truth needs to be shut down, and its speakers discredited.
There is not a racist bone in my body – there is though a strong desire to have a world that is culturally secure for all peoples across generations.
That does not mean monoculture societies but where intelligence is used to choose policies that offer all groupings protections, not all but one.
A world of some mixed societies (e.g. 33/33/33) and other less mixed (e.g. 90/10) is more diverse in total than having all societies be the former.
You have a god damn responsibility to your ancestors and your culture. You should not turn aside from it. Recognising difference between people DOES NOT MEAN seeing superiority of one over the other or supporting persecution and mistreatment of any person or grouping.
Are you not mature enough to understand such a thing?
TPOF @ #361 Saturday, April 30, 2016 at 10:30 pm
As I understood it, rates of offending and imprisonment among those of Vietnamese heritage are somewhat less than for the population taken as a whole…
http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/previous%20series/publications-archive/1980s/vietnamese-refugees-crime-rates-minors-youths-nsw.html
LGH
“Elites in the Western world (leaders, the wealthy, the educated) are the only ones in the world who do not believe in defending, promoting or advantaging the needs of their ethnicity (tribe).”
Are you sure about that? Both historically and currently? Dont get me wrong, I think capitalist Western society does try to value merit over tribe (which is part of its success) but to say there is no Western tribal allegiances in business and social dealings is wrong. I mean, check out the diversity of this mob….
Asylum seekers are now the topic du jour.
The Liberals have won.
L G H @ #371 Saturday, April 30, 2016 at 10:49 pm
You are a nazi
Well I don’t think u can have a workable system where 90% of the non western worlds population can b classed as a refugee.
I don’t think journalist in danger of jail for criticising government = person with real likelihood of being tortured & executed by ISIS.
Menzies House trolls are very busy tonight must be scared stiff that the budget will be a fizzer.
briefly you should probably retract that, I can’t imagine it going down well with anybody
Seems to me the Greens policy is that we should welcome all asylum seekers, especially those who come by boats, because that somehow “purifies” or “ennobles” them as “more desperate”
You seem to be very upset that the Greens are the only major party with a party platform that involves treating people trying to seek asylum in Australia by boat as human beings.
You could simply Google the Greens’ asylum seeker policy but that would get in the way of your bizarre and ironically highly partisan and ideological ranting over what you imagine it to be.
And Barack Obamo didnt exactly stack his cabinet with black people.
virtualkat @ #376 Saturday, April 30, 2016 at 10:53 pm
90% of asylum seekers have been found to be refugees. Not 90% of any old people.
Labor should start reminding the punters of the 2014 Budget. Do they hate ‘queue jumpers’ so much (of course there’s no queue) that they’ll inflict that on themselves and their kids? And remind them that the Government wants to increase the GST to 15% to cut their business mates’ taxes on the income they can’t hide.
Steve777 @ #374 Saturday, April 30, 2016 at 10:50 pm
Actually, the LNP have lost. Their favoured solution is no solution at all. It turns out to be no more than postponement. It’s highly likely that within a few weeks the flow of boats will resume. The policies of exemplary cruelty, conspicuous punishment and arbitrary political imprisonment will be seen to have failed. They will have to choose how to respond. It will not be possible to traffic every AS back to Indonesia – back into captivity and despair.
What will they do? They have no clue. They have failed in this as in every other thing they’ve touched.
The reason the trolls tonight are big and bright is to supplement this
Election 2016: Federal government to run $8m national security advertising blitz during campaign
http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/federal-election-2016/turnbull-government-to-run-8m-national-security-ad-blitz-during-election-campaign-20160429-goiko0.html
Airlines, I understand that but basically if u come from most Middle East countries, and a fair few Asian/African ones u will b able to claim persecution in some way and hence under current rules b classed as a refugee. I’m saying this can’t work on mass and it doesn’t give priority to those in immediate danger.
cud chewer Saturday, April 30, 2016 at 9:20 pm
I don’t think it’s because we no longer value the skills.
I was recently in Japan on holidays. One of the first things I noticed was that there seemed to be a lot more people, especially older men, in jobs that no longer seem to exist in Australia. For example, at a bank there was a man in uniform at each door greeting people as they entered.
Service is very important in Japan. In countries like Australia profit seems more important, so we’ve seen many companies retrench people in the name of cost cutting.
Technology has also had an effect. At a previous employer I remember hearing of a whole floor dedicated to accounts payable staff. That was in the 70s before accounting systems were computerised. Now there are probably just a few staff entering the details in SAP. But then technological change has been affecting the workplace for centuries. Look at the original luddites. Look at how ore was mined one hundred years ago.
Briefly – I wish I could share your faith in the 3.5% or so of voters who swiched from Labor to vote for Abbott in 2013.
TPOF Saturday, April 30, 2016 at 9:24 pm
I would pretty much agree with this (people are people) except to say, those that choose to come here by boat on average probably have more personal drive than those who stay in camps and get selected to be part of our humanitarian intake.
Personally I really hope the next Labor PM, whoever it might be, holds a Royal Commission into our treatment of asylum seekers. And the media’s treatment of asylum seekers should be included in the terms of reference.
Inconvenient facts or something you are at serious intellectual peril of you choose to dispute:
1. Western society has given rise to unique culture.
2. Current birthrates and people movements dictate ‘the West’ will lose its power & prestige and will have world wide demographics shift forcefully against it, both outside and inside their domains.
3. It is more unusual than usual for minorities to have their rights protected outside the West.
4. Even within the West minorities fend worse than the majority.
5. As ‘Western people and culture’ become more truly ‘minority’ facts 3 and 4 will have real effects.
Very strange fact that many people find very hard to believe (and hopefully they go check it so they know the truth): European people once outnumbered Africans by a significant majority. (If you are finding this hard to imagine remember how many Australian Aborigines there were… it is hard for less technologically advanced societies to have high population densities).
Just recently the numbers were in balance but with the caveat that the amount of people of child-bearing age, and children was in dramatic unbalance (think how many elderly white people there are around the world compared to elderly blacks…).
By the turn of the century, the ratio of white children to black will be less than 1 to 4. Remembering that just 150 years ago the number favoured Whites…
This is only relevant, and I repeat ONLY relevant, because of facts 3 and 4 above.
It is tough to be a minority. It is not nice to be a minority. One would not wish ones children or grandchildren to suffer as minorities.
Intelligent work now, addresses racial and global inequality and keeping an eye on Western ethnic and cultural demographics does better for ‘our tribe’ and I would say better for the rest of the world too.
Making the world a better place, being full of love for all people and being a true believer in equality DOES NOT MEAN one must give away ones cultural heritage or ability to protect and defend ones culture and people.
It is possible to be just as loving and connected to the world and all its people (and wish and act with just as much goodness to the rest of humanity) whilst protecting ones genetic and cultural heritage.
And if ‘others’ only care about their ‘tribe’ why were there 3500 muslims fighting in the US military in Iraq and Afghanistan?
Sorry Simon Katich
My reference to Western Elites was supposed to indicate that it is the majority of, not that it is unanimous.
Airlines @ #378 Saturday, April 30, 2016 at 10:54 pm
This preposterous nonsense could have come from a draft of Mein Kampf. I will stick with my conclusion, above.
Briefly
I must be the first non racist nazi then.
virtualkat @ #385 Saturday, April 30, 2016 at 11:01 pm
I’d argue that people who are going to be jailed or killed based on their sexual orientation, ethnicity, religion or political belief are in immediate danger.
Making the world a better place, being full of love for all people and being a true believer in equality DOES NOT MEAN one must give away ones cultural heritage or ability to protect and defend ones culture and people.
Does that mean we have to fight for to wear thongs tee shirts and daggy shorts
You have a god damn responsibility to your ancestors and your culture. You should not turn aside from it.
I am responsible to nobody except whoever I damn please, thank you very much; and your suggestions that non-whites look after their own kind and would not extend a hand to an Australia in need are at worst race-baiting and at best profoundly uncharitable and delusional.
Steve777 @ #387 Saturday, April 30, 2016 at 11:05 pm
Labor will win the election. This is not in doubt. The collapse of the Manus venture makes this more likely. For one thing, Turnbot will try to Tone-Up. This will fail. He does not do tough. He is, as we all know, nothing but a marshmallow in a good suit. The more he tries to toughen up, the more confused his persona will become. Voters will be thinking of Abbott…feeling deeply repelled…thinking that madness is descending again…and flee in their millions from the Liberals.
BB maybe you are confusing an ideology with a fanatic
ideology is important – it is what is lacking, esp or even in greens (do they have a coherent philosophy – do any other main parties?)
it is use of ideology, esp degraded or contradictory ones, that is issue
a fanatic seems to hold a degraded belief regardless of implications
i prefer fabianism or gradual change – strangely both parties esp liberals can be guilty of revolutionary changes – in part to gain media attention
if turnbull had sought more modest changes to various taxation areas including gst he would be very comfortable now
greens use half cocked belief at time in revolutionary gestures without any pragmatic strategy of reform
In short, you believe the delusion that there’s a queue. Please go back to summarizing Ray Hadley’s show. More realistic.
labor 54. could be higher. almost there