Courtesy of The Guardian, this week’s Essential Research poll has Labor’s two-party lead bouncing back to 54-46, after two weeks at 52-48. Primary votes will have to wait for later. The poll also has particularly interesting supplementary questions this week in relation to the National Broadband Network. Only 24% of respondents expressed support for the Coalition government’s fibre-to-the-node downgrade, compared with 43% who preferred Labor’s abandoned fibre-to-the-premises plan. The network’s failures are attributed to the government by 39%, compared with only 19% for Labor. Fifty-four per cent rated that the NBN would “fail to adequately meet Australia’s future internet requirements”, with 23% saying otherwise. However, 52% thought the NBN had improved their service (presumably where applicable), compared with only 17% who thought it worse and 28% about the same.
Yes. If Labor is confident then there’s no reason for them to not welcome an audit.
Yeah. Nah. It will look like capitulation.
Let everyone else run around like headless chooks undergoing an audit. Labor are confident they don’t need to. And don’t you think they would have sub-audited themselves/all their MPs by now just to be sure?
Good afternoon all,
Why does labor have to agree to a audit ? Turnbull is the PM. He would have it within his power to establish such a investigation and appoint a ” respected ” legal person to oversee the process surely ?
Anyway, if such a audit does require legislation to establish then Turnbull would have the numbers without labor.
It is within the power of Turnbull either way to set this up regardless of labor.
Turnbull is the PM. If he is confident then go for it.
Cheers.
No audit needed. All it takes is one Additional LNP member to be disqualified and all bets are off.
Which will be faster? Finding anothe citizenship breach or the. Ongoing case of Profit under the Crown?
Ides of March @ #997 Wednesday, November 1st, 2017 – 4:36 pm
It’s a tradition. And these days we have the added fun of him using touch screens.
(to be fair, it’s harder to work with props, especially technical ones, than it looks)
But back to the point. The fact is that the MSM (including Tony Jones) were all getting very shitty with Shorten for not showing his renouncement proof. Made him look like he had a bunch of “questions to answer”. And now that we have a LIB who is actually ineligible “IT’S RIDICULOUS!”
Are you really implying that the ABC puts words into Antony Green’s mouth and risks his (and thus their) reputation as probably the most respected election analyst in the country in order to what shift public perception of Parry’s circumstances by maybe 0.2% ? That doesn’t even begin to make sense.
Psephologists often have their own opinions about the rules under which elections operate under. Neither Bonham nor Green to give two clear examples were at all shy about their opinions about Group Ticket Voting at the time (they said it sucked balls but more eloquently) and it’s not exactly a challenging tast to tell Kevin Bonham doesn’t like Unweighted Inclusive Gregory.
Even assuming there is a giant ABC conspiracy to keep the Libs in government (unlikely since organizing that in an organization that knows the Libs cut their funding at every opportunity would be almost impossible) it would not spend valuable and potential public opinion shifting capital on a matter that it a) would have roughly 0 impact on and b) doesn’t actually matter in anyway.
Doyley @ #999 Wednesday, November 1st, 2017 – 3:39 pm
Is it? Wouldn’t an audit require funding, and therefore need to be supported by legislation?
If so, Turnbull can’t just pass an audit by decree. He’d need to get at least some support from Labor, Greens, or every other minor party member in the Senate.
Although they could probably use the same “urgent and unforeseen” discretionary fund that they used for the postal survey farce. There’s a much stronger case for arguing that there’s an urgent and unforeseen need for a citizenship audit than there was for a postal survey on marriage equality. The latter thing got up, so the former should sail through without challenge.
Turnbull has no power whatsoever to unilaterally perform an audit of the Senate. That would violate separation of powers *twice* (once as the Executive acting against a Legislative House and once as the Leader of the House acting against the Senate).
The Houses would have to determine to determine to perform the audits upon themselves or legislation would have to be passed.
AR,
As I said in my post, if Turnbull does need legislation he would be able to get it through. The greens and cross bench would support him.
He does not need the support of labor either way. Labor is not standing in his way. If Turnbull is confident then roll the dice !
Cheers.
Can the HC void an entire election for a higher number of inelligible candidates elected? What would be the end test?
30 mps out of 150
75 mps out of 150
10 senators
35 senators?
Wonder if any of the tv news bulletins will lead with Parry and the government in turmoil tonight. None did last night. Pushed back to the 10-15 minute mark last night. I guess jingoism will probably win out.
I will say it again. Labor does not need to call for an audit. All they need is one additional LNP gone bye bye Speakers casting vote.
Elaugaufein,
Yes, I am saying that when Turnbull was slamming Shorten about his citizenship status, the media, including the ABC, treated it seriously.
Now that a LIB who was in a similar situation to Shorten, but didn’t do his paperwork, has been deemed ineligible, it is suddenly “what bad luck, how ridiculous the rules are”.
Come on. Green is a Blue. Everyone knows.
If Green was a Red he’d be Yellow and thats just silly.
Look at the stars,
Look how they shine for you,
And everything you do,
Yeah, they were all yellow
guytaur @ #959 Wednesday, November 1st, 2017 – 3:38 pm
Interesting? Bloody moronic.
Shorten and Wong and a few other people with brains should pull Jay aside and say, very funny, now put through whoever the fuck X nominates. In fact they should just say it publicly. That’s the sort of scumbag shit Libs do to us. It would be Obeid level filth to start mucking around with Senate casual vacancies.
Simon Katich @ #1010 Wednesday, November 1st, 2017 – 4:57 pm
I’m not sure what Green is, may even be ALP.
The funny thing is that Uhlmann has become a hell of a lot less annoying since he left the ABC. Of course, that could change any minute.
I think the L-NP’s constant harassment of the ABC does have an effect.
guytaur
Irrelevant , the government has 1 standing guarantee of supply and confidence , and another 2 who would likely continue to provide it. Labor needs another 3 liberals lost.
Ides of March
The Court of Dispute Returns can order a new election, but it wouldn’t be just on the number of ineligibles (there’s a defined procedure for dealing with that so no issues arise). If it comes to the situation where the eliminations result in recounts with clearly perverse results (the loss of an entire party ticket maybe) or where it’s no longer clear to say someone is validly elected they might pr maybe in Tasmania as it currently stands if the HC returns Corbeck initially and PHON then challenges McKim’s election. I still can’t see that being done on a national scale though. It’d be per state in the Senate alone and only as / when the countback couldn’t be held to accurately represent the intention of the original election, and likely someone could provide persuasive mathematics evidence of such)
Jennett. Public loss of confidence. Its become catastrophic
Worth reposting 🙂
https://youtu.be/rY0WxgSXdEE
ratsak
Weatherill could only practically do that with Xenophon’s tacit consent in any case. If Xenophon actually objects he can just expel the upstart from his party and they are no longer a valid replacement. I have no idea what Weatherill is trying to accomplish here , it looks bad for the reasons you said and it can’t possible achieve anything.
Elau
Not irrelevant. Katter is already playing games. With actual BOP at stake he won’t be only cross bench person making noise about rethinking support of confidence.
The practical has a way of testing theory.
A senator has resigned, where is the evidence that the HC will be involved?
Oh sweet child, such a quaint notion that you dredge up from the far reaches of your fevered imagination – ‘giant ABC consipracy’ indeed!
The ABC conspires to nothing, certainly nothing giant. Its news and current affairs division is milquetoast, terrified of more complaints from the jackbooted ones.
Some of its journos think LNP anyway, so that’s a neat fit, most of the others lost their nerve and their verve long ago!
Katter is playing games to bring home pork , he has no serious intention of overthrowing a government he has by the balls. It’s the same reason Xenophon quickly overruled Sharkie on withdrawing confidence.
John Webster @ #1018 Wednesday, November 1st, 2017 – 4:07 pm
The HC has to decide how the vacancy will be filled?
Ratsak
Weatherill is creating disunity in a party in the lead up toan election.
We don’t know how serious his seeking legal advice is. Forcing Xenophon to expel aarty member could be a good result.
John Webster
The Senator was invalidly elected only the Court of Disputed Returns can declare them invalid and order a recount to replace them. The Houses themselves are bound by the conventions on casual vacancies from resignations (even if due to invalidity). The Senate could potentially decline to refer the matter to the High Court (and thus things would proceed as per a a casual vacancy), but given that there are potentially electoral issues of interest to PHON arising from this issue , it would be blatantly partisan not to do so in this case, and damage the Senate’s reputation, so there is no real chance they won’t do so.
A R
John Webster @ #1018 Wednesday, November 1st, 2017 – 4:07 pm
A senator has resigned, where is the evidence that the HC will be involved?
The HC has to decide how the vacancy will be filled?
The HC can’t do anything on its own initiative. It’s not uncommon for senators and MPs to resign and HC never decides anything.
Certainly the HC requires a referral, but seeing as Parry has admitted the reason he has ‘resigned’ was because he was never bloody eligible it’s a pretty brave bet to think no one is going to refer it to the court of disputed returns. The fact there is a real question of if Parry’s resignation elects a PHON candidate just means referral is as close to a certainty as you can get. PHON will be all over it even if no one else does, and it would look even dodgier than most of the dodgy stuff this govt gets up to to not refer off their own bat.
Brandis is stupid, but not that stupid. He will refer to the HC for a decision on how to replace Parry.
Elau
That argument is a great one for why Cross Bench could rethink.
Much better to actually have someone by the balls than rescind your levarage before negotiating even begins.
At this point its moot. However if those numbers change.
Simon Katich @ #1014 Wednesday, November 1st, 2017 – 4:57 pm
I’ll have some of what you’ve been smoking! 🙂
Speaking of Katter, any chance he is a dual national?
Ive been hearing rumblings he may have Lebanese citizenship?
C@tmomma @ #1027 Wednesday, November 1st, 2017 – 5:14 pm
It’s good stuff!
Come to think of it. I think Green is most likely GRN 🙂
guytaur
Expelling a party member who’s clearly acting against the party wishes with respect to a casual vacancy isn’t controversial, it’s pro forma.
guytaur @ #1022 Wednesday, November 1st, 2017 – 5:10 pm
No it’s a shit result and a shit thing to do. Inexcusable. If he doesn’t hurry the fuck up and do what he should do – confirm whoever NXT say they want, then I hope he cops the mother of all hidings in the state election and I hope Federal Labor has enough sense to publicly drop him like a stone.
You just don’t fuck around with this.
It is of the same level of abuse of process as Cash’s witch hunt. I might be rusted on Labor, but I put the country first (which is why I’m rusted on Labor). I despise the Coalition because this is the sort of grubs they are. Any Labor person engaging in the same sort of behaviour are the same sort of grubs.
Elau
Its a sign of disunity. A big vote loser at election time.
A party fighting over who gets the Senate seat should make some good attack lines for the majors.
I’m not sure what Green is, may even be ALP.
Green by name…
Rex Douglas @ #975 Wednesday, November 1st, 2017 – 3:05 pm
The pathetic ones Rex are the politicians whom have not done the work. In the words of Baaaaaarnaby they are a “goose” and what did Trumble say or do I have to do that homework for yiu Rex
As I see it all they have to do is rember some info on their parents, check the internet, make a call, employ an agent if their is a concern, then tick a box. Many of them have had ample time to do that. Baaaaaaarnamby had 4 goes.
If they can’t or won’t do this it then speaks volume’s of the character and work ethic of that person. The old adage is past performance is a good indicator of future performance.
ratsak
Apparently we agree on the importance of correct democratic process and not abusing the powers of the state for electoral ends. Hear hear! Basically.
Its conclusive. The Liberals are from the Golgafrinchen Ark Ship B 🙂
Elaugaufein @ #1035 Wednesday, November 1st, 2017 – 5:21 pm
Play hard, but play fair.
C@tmomma @ #1033 Wednesday, November 1st, 2017 – 5:20 pm
Yep, on reflection that would be my guess.
GT
No, it’s not. Expelling someone who is clearly placing their self interest ahead of the party by not even seeking to have the party present them as an option, but directly approaching the legislature themselves is 150% legitimate and it’s part of the reason the clause is written the way it is (that was part of the Senate shenanigans that led to the Whitlam dismissal and result in that constitutional amendment).
This has nothing to do with politics and everything to do with ‘WOW!’
https://www.digitaltrends.com/cool-tech/silk-could-cure-spinal-injuries/?utm_source=sendgrid&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=daily-brief
Humans. So constructive one minute. So destructive the next.
Ratsak
We shall see. How far Weatherill goes depends on the politics.
So we will see how serious it is. Meanwhile Nxt has infighting over a Senate seat being the story of the day
C@tmomma @ #1027 Wednesday, November 1st, 2017 – 4:14 pm
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yKNxeF4KMsY
cud chewer @ #1036 Wednesday, November 1st, 2017 – 4:22 pm
Well, Dutton is without doubt a direct descendant of Officer #2
C@t
I’d be very surprised if Green was a Green. Some of his commentary of them when they were a relatively new party coming up was accurate but harshly phrased and unlikely to come from a supporter*. Unless he had a major change of political viewpoint since. But he’s really damn good at keeping his own political beliefs out of his analysis.
*e.g . he was completely correct to say the Greens preferencing against PHON in Queensland in PHON’s first go around wasn’t news, since it was both completely predictable and unlikely to make any difference whatsoever (it’s difficult to even theoretically envision a seat where both parties are strong enough to be relevant) but it’s hardly the comment you’d expect from a supporter hoping a new party gets media coverage.
briefly @ #801 Wednesday, November 1st, 2017 – 11:19 am
I agree entirely.
I have respect for those who participated in the battle.
I respect and honour my father and his comrades in WWII, but I have no wish to re-enact their lives.
Weatherill should appoint whoever SA Best/NXT want. End of story.
El,
Maybe Green was being cruel to be kind? 🙂