The Australian relates yet another 53-47 result from Newspoll, with both major parties down a point on the primary vote: the Coalition to 35% and Labor to 36%, with One Nation steady on 11% and the Greens, despite it all, up a point to 10%. Of personal ratings, only the following at this stage:
Mr Turnbull’s net satisfaction rating — the difference between those satisfied and those dissatisfied with his performance — deteriorated slightly from -23 points to -24 points over the past three weeks. In contrast, Mr Shorten improved his net satisfaction rating from -23 to -20 points in today’s poll, showing another improvement in his standing with voters since he slumped to -28 points in March.
UPDATE: GhostWhoVotes relates that Malcolm Turnbull is steady on 32% approval and up one on disapproval to 56%; Bill Shorten is respectively up one to 33% and down two to 53%; and Turnbull’s lead as preferred prime minister has narrowed from 44-31 to 41-33.
briefly @ #642 Tuesday, July 11th, 2017 – 5:40 pm
If they had been invented in the current age there would have been five but adultery would still be in.
briefly @ #642 Tuesday, July 11, 2017 at 5:40 pm
Presumably from the usage when the KJV Bible was translated.
It also appears to have a slightly different shade of meaning as a “command from an authority”.
Seems like something is going on!
Craig Emerson @DrCraigEmerson 20h20 hours ago
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I’ve never seen such an orchestrated destruction of a Coalition leader by the conservative commentariat since the 1987 Joh-for-PM campaign
Tony Abbott will not listen to anyone in the Liberal Party! He won’t go anywhere either because he has his Federal Electorate Conference sewn up as well.
To use a biblical allusion, as it is the subject du jour today…
Hell hath no fury like a Tony Abbott scorned!
Though I also make the observation that Malcolm Turnbull has seen off a few adversaries in his time as well.
This battle for the heart and soul of the Liberal Party is going to be one to watch.
As someone observed today, I think it was, this battle between the Moderates and the Conservatives in the Liberal Party has all the hallmarks of the Labor Party split of 1955.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the Conservatives coalesce under Cory Bernardi’s ‘Australian Conservatives’ banner and PHON, the Liberal Conservatives, and maybe even the most conservative Nationals join together to create a new Conservative Party.
We might also see the Moderate Liberals join with Nick Xenophon’s party and the Blue Greens, but stay under the Liberal Party logo.
The rest of the Greens might be reabsorbed into the Labor Party.
Who knows what sort of election results we might get from that lot! However, as the saying goes, ‘there is strength in numbers’, and I can see the political hard heads like Peta Credlin, thinking similarly.
greensborough growler @ #644 Tuesday, July 11, 2017 at 5:43 pm
Can’t speak for C@t, but my views are long held and arose in my childhood.
I tend to follow the ethics of Christianity more closely than to may self-proclaimed “Christians”.
I just don’t believe in any of the voodoo supernatural stuff in it.
bemused @ #655 Tuesday, July 11th, 2017 – 6:03 pm
You’d have made a worthy Methodist!
Cheers.
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2017/jul/11/push-for-new-coal-fired-power-station-in-queensland-nonsense-state-minister?CMP=share_btn_tw
c@tmomma @ #654 Tuesday, July 11, 2017 at 6:03 pm
Would you want them in your branch?
This is a disgrace and must be stopped.
http://www.theage.com.au/nsw/police-investigating-racist-posters-plastered-across-sydneys-inner-west-20170710-gx8mcy.html
Would you want them in your branch?
We’ve tamed worse! 😀
However, I know some of them quite well and they’re not as kooky as you might think and friends with, guess who? Father Rod! Whom I have been told, actually votes Liberal!
It’s a funny old world.
greensborough growler @ #656 Tuesday, July 11, 2017 at 6:06 pm
“The 10 commandments (wtf?? why not just “commands”?) are not especially Christian. Their origin is in Hebrew story-telling.”
Yes, and the Christian “extension/replacement” of the 10 comandments is the eight beatitudes from the Sermon on the Mount.
But the Old Testament is always more attractive to the “straighteners” of our society. And, admittedly the teachings of Jesus are far too threatening to the powerful.
GG, I could never be a Methodist. Their purely functional taste is way too boring for me! 🙂
GG @ 4:16PM:
“The context for my comments was in response to briefly who raised the statistics from the recently held Census. His point was that ‘No religion” topped the pops and so that justified a flurry of commentary from him about a specific social issue. My point is and was that over 50% responded as a Christian of some some denomination and that there were a further collection of about 20% from other religions. This says to me that religion and especially Christian religions are still a major driving force of underlying values in this country.
Regardless of whether people attend Church or are particularly pious, the underlying values still dominate our culture and self perceptions. That is a clear message from the Census.
I respect this might not specifically apply to you. However, it is what it is.”
OK, that’s fair enough – and my apologies for snapping at you. However, I still hold that regular religious attendance (while not perfect) is a far better barometer of the social influence of religious beliefs than “Do you identify with X” Census results. And given that Christian teachings on homosexuality are not unified, and are also not central to most Churches’ dogma, I also believe that it’s not as big an impact in this particular issue.
But we can agree to disagree on that much, at least. Again, I’m sorry I snapped at you.
C@tmomma @ #654 Tuesday, July 11th, 2017 – 6:03 pm
Nice post.
Turnbull has been talking closely with Macron who I believe is the french version of Turnbull. You will recall his recent smashing victory in France at both the Presidential and parliamentary levels. So, Turnbull is clearly upping the ante for his opponents. I reckon if there is any sign of real insubordination Turnbull will be off to the polls.
He’s had a gutful of disunity and knows it isn’t going to stop.
The new politics is all about new alliances.
c@tmomma @ #660 Tuesday, July 11, 2017 at 6:12 pm
Ancient religions with multiple gods had practical purposes.
Monotheistic religions (which aren’t really since many have angels or daddy, laddie & spook hierarchies) began as methods of social control, where they tried to exert power via the use of asceticism.
I understand the psychological need of religion as a crutch to those who fear their own mortality, but the unequal power exerted by churches to control the populace is basic human nature … nothing in the least mystical about it.
The mysticism is just salesmanship/advertising methodology.
Ancient religions with multiple gods had practical purposes.
Monotheistic religions (which aren’t really since many have angels or daddy, laddie & spook hierarchies) began as methods of social control, where they tried to exert power via the use of asceticism.
I understand the psychological need of religion as a crutch to those who fear their own mortality, but the unequal power exerted by churches to control the populace is basic human nature … nothing in the least mystical about it.
The mysticism is just salesmanship/advertising methodology.
Matt @ #664 Tuesday, July 11th, 2017 – 6:18 pm
Apology accepted and good on you for doing it.
I would just say that two regular commentators bemused and momma have actually confirmed my assertions regarding the underlying Christian values that drive our community values on this blog tonight.
This is my interpretation and there is no intention to verbal. But, I believe I’m right.
Oh how I love to hear Trumble crspping on about Menzies etc etc.
Oh I love to hear Frydenberg crapping on about Menzies and how the LNP doesn’t represent big business.
Oh how I love to hear Pyne crapping on about Liberal values.
I just know how well it will resonate with voters.
Turnbull is most unlikely to the polls. Apart from dislocating House and 1/2 Senate elections, the polls would forbid it. In any car, the RW echelons in the Liberal Party are going to withdraw. They will not want to carry the blame for the destruction of a Liberal Government. They know Abbott is self-immolation in waiting. They know they are nothing outside the Liberal Party.
So the RW will step back and wait. Turnbull has asserted his case. The stand-off will continue.
bemused @ #630 Tuesday, July 11th, 2017 – 5:08 pm
I tend to think that the homosexual community won’t care about whatever new term(s) may be coined, so long as they’re not given any special status under the law. “Marriage” isn’t just a word that straight people use, it’s also a civil construct given special legal standing by virtue of legislation. Marriage equality is about the latter thing, not who uses which legally irrelevant words.
If one looks closely, one can find the germs of the 10 commandments in ancient Egypt – particularly under Pharaoh Horemheb (18th dynasty – known to Christians as Aaron). Just as the Lord’s Prayer is an extrapolation of the “Little Hymn to the Aten”.
Moses (known to Christians as Ramses I) delivered from the sacred ark, the Pharaoh’s cartouche.
A deep study of ancient cultures would disburse most people of modern religious adherence (certainly did so for me).
That said – so-called Christian ethics (let’s say human ethics) are a great foundation for life.
I have been hearing opinions that “Menzies never intended to start a conservative party!”
Strange, why did they ban all those books and films – such as Norman Lindsay’s “Saturdee”. And D.H. Lawrence, obviously – and Joyce’s “Ulysses”. Not conservative? Pull the other one!
Menzies’ main purpose was to oppose Curtin and Chifley, and he had the backing of business big and small. In those days BHP and Coles were “big business”. I suspect there was a strong anti-Catholic theme as well.
How the PaTH ($4/hour internships) will actually work:
C@t
Actually a literary rather than biblical allusion…I thought it was William Shakespeare but turns out to be William Congreve.
phylactella @ #674 Tuesday, July 11th, 2017 – 6:35 pm
I’m sure Menzies played the cards he was dealt. History says he did a fair job.
It’s always a mistake to judge history by today’s standards.
C@tmomma @ #663 Tuesday, July 11th, 2017 – 6:16 pm
I was talking about bemused. Sorry for any offence.
a r @ #672 Tuesday, July 11, 2017 at 6:32 pm
I seems to me to be about ownership of a word.
Akin to how they have appropriated the word “gay”.
adrian @ #670 Tuesday, July 11th, 2017 – 6:30 pm
You’ll only hear it on the ABC though!
Hi All
The polls are confusing. Given that Tony Abbott lost 30 Newspolls and was disliked by the public (please note I am a conservative and think he’s the bees knees, but I know the lay of the land), you would think that his public reaffirmation of conservative beliefs would hugely help Malcolm Turnbull, as public would say Thank God for Malcolm Turnbull, who also is in fact taking over Labor policies to a large degree.
You would think the Turnbull Party would be way way ahead of Bill Shorten?
I don’t get it. Anyone have an opinion? I think the political commentators are flummoxed as well.
GG
Nope – I am judging by the standards of the 1950’s and 60’s. My father was a Menzies supporter – the unions were “greedy”. He knew Holt at Queens College and had a poor opinion of him. One of Menzies’ many mistakes was to dispose of any worthy successors, such as Casey. (Rather like Howard) .
It took me a few years (very few) in work to see which groups were the greediest. The Vietnam war and conscription finally showed me how the class war was fought.
How come I cannot post!
prettyone @ #681 Tuesday, July 11, 2017 at 6:47 pm
Yep!
Turnbull is a dork and Liberal policies are toxic.
Stamps?
The mysticism is just salesmanship/advertising methodology.
…
I think, Jenauthor, you may find that many people in their most desperate times of crisis, a child in danger, terminal illness, turn to a God and ask for help. To save their child, to save their life.
The belief in a God is innate, in my opinion.
It’s all across the world, Muslim, Jewish, Hindus etc, going a back a very long time. In my opinion, advertising does not explain that.
PrettyOne,
Thank God for Malcolm Turnbull, who also is in fact taking over Labor policies to a large degree.
You would think the Turnbull Party would be way way ahead of Bill Shorten?
The logical inconsistency at the heart of that statement should tell you that, if Malcolm Turnbull is nicking Bill Shorten’s policies, why would people not choose to go with the original rather than the uninspired fake?
phylactella @ #682 Tuesday, July 11th, 2017 – 6:49 pm
Yeah, well it’s pretty obvious to me that the world of pre 1950 is not Australia today. My father lived in a dirt floor house. My mother had just endured years of bombing terror from the Nazi blitz as a child.
So, yeah things are different today.
But, you keep fighting your class war.
bemused @ #680 Tuesday, July 11th, 2017 – 6:41 pm
I disagree. But it’s simple enough to test. Just give them “marriage”, and then see if the gay community continues protesting and demanding legislation changes for other words.
I think they won’t. 🙂
prettyone
What the polls have consistently said for almost a decade now is that people want the kinds of policies Labor stands for. They didn’t like the infighting in the Labor party, Abbott promised Labor policies plus a free set of steak knives, he didn’t deliver, so the Liberals switched to Malcolm Turnbull (who people generally thought would deliver Labor policies with a free set of steak knives) and he hasn’t delivered either.
The Liberals best bet all along has been to promise to deliver the same kinds of policies Labor stands for, but do so in a more efficient way. They’re not capable of doing either, and thus revert back to the neo conservative agenda they understand, but don’t dare actually take to an election.
Prettyone
Tuesday, July 11, 2017 at 6:47 pm
Voters see the Liberals for what they actually are – vainglorious, self-serving, malicious, untrustworthy, deceptive of themselves and the public, and thoroughly incompetent.
PrettyOne,
I think, Jenauthor, you may find that many people in their most desperate times of crisis, a child in danger, terminal illness, turn to a God and ask for help. To save their child, to save their life.
The belief in a God is innate, in my opinion.
Having actually been in that position I can categorically state that God was the last thing I turned to. I summoned up my own intestinal fortitude and resources and my child’s life was duly saved by my efforts and the efforts of his father. And the medical community.
http://www.starobserver.com.au/news/international-news-news/dozens-gay-men-believed-executed-chechnya/159905
Well, I don’t go to church but I would not say shit for a shilling.
Bemused is completely correct. Those damn ‘homosexuals’ should bally well just use the words ascribed to them by those like bemused who know how things should be!!!!!!
Prettyone
Tuesday, July 11, 2017 at 6:56 pm
The mysticism is just salesmanship/advertising methodology.
…
I think, Jenauthor, you may find that many people in their most desperate times of crisis, a child in danger, terminal illness, turn to a God and ask for help. To save their child, to save their life.
The belief in a God is innate, in my opinion.
I’m an innate disbeliever. I can recall, as a child, having fled from Sunday school, sitting in the back row at Big Church, observing the adults. They were going through the rites of worship. There and then I decided they could not be serious – that no sensible person could possibly believe the mumbo-jumbo. I’ve never looked back.
https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2017/jul/11/melinda-gates-deeply-troubled-by-trump-cuts-to-family-planning-funds?CMP=twt_gu
T
a r @ #689 Tuesday, July 11, 2017 at 6:59 pm
Oh, I’m sure we will be running that test soon enough.
I can’t wait for that particular caravan to move on.
Briefly
Same here. I am agnostic for the reason I cannot disprove there is a god. However if there is I doubt stupid ceremonies would do anything to impress them.