Nielsen: 53-47 to Coalition in Queensland

More mixed messages from Queensland, along with one very clear one – here comes Clive Palmer.

Two new polls out today from Queensland, one being another of Newspoll’s composite marginal seat jobs, the other a statewide Nielsen survey of 1014 respondents. Taken together, the two continue a confounding pattern throughout this campaign of localised polling from Queensland painting a grimmer picture for Labor than polling conducted statewide. The Newspoll survey targets 800 respondents in seven of the state’s eight Labor-held seats – Moreton (1.1%), Petrie (2.5%), Lilley (3.2%), Capricornia (3.7%), Blair (4.2%), Rankin (5.4%) and Oxley (5.8%) – the odd man out being Kevin Rudd’s seat of Griffith (8.5%). The combined primary vote results are 38% for Labor (down from 42.4% at the 2010 election), 42% for the Coalition (up from 39.8%), 8% for the Greens (down from 11.0%) and 12% for “others” (up substantially from 6.8% – hold that thought). On two-party preferred, the result is 51-49 in favour of the Coalition, a swing of 4.7%. Importantly though, this has been determined based on preference flows from the 2010 election. Hold that thought as well.

The Nielsen poll as published in the Fairfax papers comes with a headline two-party preferred figure of 53-47, which is at least superficially encouraging for Labor in that it suggests a swing of 2% from 2010. Unlike the Newspoll result, this comes from respondent-allocated rather than previous-election preferences (hold that thought still further). However, the real story the poll has to tell lies in the primary vote figures. Labor is at just 31%, down from 34.6% in 2010, but the Coalition is also down slightly, from 46.5% to 45%. The Greens are on 8%, down on 10.9% at the 2010 election but at the high end of what they’ve been getting generally in Queensland in recent times (perhaps reflecting an improving trend nationally which is perceptible on the BludgerTrack charts). However, the really interesting result is that the Palmer United Party is on 8%, putting into the shade Katter’s Australian Party on 4%.

This cannot dismissed as one freak result, as it has been corroborated by other polling. Roy Morgan has twice had occasion over the last week to trumpet this phenomenon going on beneath the surface of its “others” result. The first poll, published on Friday, had the Palmer United Party at 4% nationally and 6.5% in Queensland. The second, published yesterday, maintained the 4% national result while finding the Queensland figure up to 7.5%. I’m advised that Essential Research also had the party at 4% nationally in its polling this week and at 9% in Queensland, after it barely registered in previous weeks. In fact, the three sets of Queensland polling I have seen over the past few days have all turned in remarkably similar results for Labor, Coalition, Greens and “others” alike.

A clearer picture emerges if the totality of polling from Queensland is plotted out since the return of Kevin Rudd. The chart below maps out the trend from 37 such polls from seven different pollsters, with the usual BludgerTrack accuracy weightings and bias adjustments applied. Black represents the combined “others” vote.

The starting point is a landslip in Labor’s favour after Gillard was deposed, which appeared to consolidate for a fortnight before entering a long and steady slide. Then came the announcement of the election date at the start of August and a two-week period where Queensland appeared to buck the national trend of the time by moving to Labor. This may very well have been a dividend from the recruitment of Peter Beattie, however much media reportage and individual seat polls might have suggested that there wasn’t one.

A new phase then appeared to begin a fortnight ago with the sharp rise of the “others” vote. This has coincided with an onslaught of television advertising from Clive Palmer which has seemed almost to rival that of the major parties. Whereas Palmer’s earlier advertising looked like it belonged on Vine rather than network television, his current efforts appear rehearsed and properly thought out – perhaps even market-researched. Most importantly, the substance of their message – tax cuts which pay for themselves and pension schemes that boost the economy by $70 billion – may well be striking a chord in offering voters the ever more scarce political commodity of “vision”, hallucinogenic though it may be in this particular case.

The other point to be noted about the surge in the “others” vote over the past fortnight is that it looks to be coming more at Labor’s expense than the Coalition’s. For one thing, this has significant implications for the party’s prospects of actually converting votes into seats. Mark Kenny of Fairfax’s take on the Nielsen result is that while it is “almost certain Mr Palmer’s party will not win a seat in the House of Representatives, it is in with a chance of gaining a spot in the Senate”. However, I’m not so sure about this on either count.

Clive Palmer himself is running in the smartly chosen Sunshine Coast seat of Fairfax, where the retirement of Alex Somlyay relieves him of the burden of having to take on a sitting member. The first task facing Palmer is to outpoll Labor, who scored 27.3% in 2010. Gouging votes directly at their expense will make that task a lot easier, as presumably will the fact the Greens (who polled a weighty 18.0% last time) are directing their preferences to him. Palmer’s next hurdle (inappropriate as athletic metaphors might be in his case) would be to overcome Liberal National Party candidate Ted O’Brien, which might not be so easy given Alex Somlyay’s 49.5% vote in 2010. Some credible seat-level polling from Fairfax would be very interesting to see. As for the Senate, lead candidate Glenn Lazarus faces the complication that James Blundell of Katter’s Australian Party has done better out of preferences, standing to directly receive (among other things) Labor’s surplus after the election of its second candidate.

The other point to be made regarding a movement from Labor to the Palmer United Party relates to the issue of deriving two-party preferred results from primary votes in opinion polls. This is always a slightly vexed question, as for most voters the act of vote choice runs no deeper than simply deciding “who to vote for”, be it a party or its leader. If that choice is for a minor party, the question of preference allocation – secondary though it may be for the voter concerned – is the thing that really matters with respect to determining the result. Since the decision is often driven by a how-to-vote card the voter does not see until they arrive at the polling booth, and is in many cases entirely arbitrary, there is limited value in an opinion pollster asking the voter what they propose to do.

For this reason, it has become standard practice over the past decade for pollsters to instead allocate minor party preferences according to how they flowed at the previous election. Only Morgan persists in favouring respondent allocation, with Nielsen conducting both measures while normally using the previous election preferences for its top-line results. Not coincidentally, the primacy of this method has emerged over a period in which the minor party landscape has remained fairly stable, with the dominant Greens being supplemented by a shifting aggregation of smaller concerns, most of them being right-wing in one way or another. However, it was always clear that the utility of the method would be undermined if substantial new minor parties emerged, particularly on the right. For example, the result of the 1996 election would have offered no guidance in allocating votes for Pauline Hanson’s One Nation when it exploded on to the scene a year later.

So it is with the Palmer United Party, at least so far as Queensland is concerned. It might have been anticipated that the party’s conservative provenance would have caused its preferences to behave much as other right-wing minor parties to emerge out of Queensland have done over the years, but the Nielsen poll throws that into doubt by finding that 62% of Palmer United Party voters (together with 55% of Katter’s Australian Party voters) intend to give their preference to Labor. It should be borne in mind here that these sub-samples are extremely small, and consequently have double-digit error margins. Eighty-six per cent of Greens voters said they would preference Labor, which is well above what’s plausible. Even so, it’s perhaps telling that the most recent national Nielsen poll, published the weekend before last, had the Coalition’s lead in Queensland at 55-45 on previous election preferences, but only 52-48 on respondent-allocated preferences – an enormous difference as these things go.

Taken together with the trends observable in the primary vote chart above, it would appear that the last fortnight has seen Labor lose votes in Queensland to the Palmer United Party, and that this pool of voters contains a much larger proportion of Labor identifiers than the non-Greens minor party vote in 2010. So while the recent rise of the Palmer United Party might not be good news for Labor in absolute terms, it may cause two-party preferred projections based on the normal pattern of minor party vote behaviour to be skewed against them. This certainly applies to the BludgerTrack model in its present form, for which I might look at adding a Queensland-specific fix (with the qualification that anything I come up with will of necessity be somewhat arbitrary).

UPDATE: AMR Research has published its third online poll of federal voting intention, conducted between Friday and Monday from a sample of 1101, and it has Labor at 34%, the Coalition at 44% and the Greens at 10%.

Author: William Bowe

William Bowe is a Perth-based election analyst and occasional teacher of political science. His blog, The Poll Bludger, has existed in one form or another since 2004, and is one of the most heavily trafficked websites on Australian politics.

1,555 comments on “Nielsen: 53-47 to Coalition in Queensland”

Comments Page 30 of 32
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  1. Hash Convicts@1449

    William Bowe

    Dimwit and douchebag are my idea of personal. Steer clear of that sort of thing and maybe I’ll allow another swipe.
    ——
    Honestly, I’m not bothered by it mate, but if its in the rules i respect it. I find it more amusing and look at it as an indication that Ive done my job.

    Regardless all is good.

    You haven’t explained ANYTHING. What is your upload speed? And max download speed?
    #fraudband

  2. paaptsef

    Hash convicts you are advocating spending almost as much on upgrading 18th century technology as would be spent installing 21st century technology and what I am asking is where is the advantage in doing that?
    ——–

    I understand what you are saying. The thing is do we spend on what we believe to be the fastest technology now or upgrade a little to tie us over for a possibly better technology due to the pace of it continually growing. There are also the other factors to consider, like the ones i mentioned above (you can read them if you like). Money and those issue I raised are also very viable factors. For me personally, I believe the right direction is the upgrade, you might feel different. 🙂

  3. Henry

    Simple question Hash C.
    What is the coalitions upload speed on their #fraudband?
    Can you name it?
    ——
    Well Henry, I answered this a page back if you check. Although amusing, it is funny how you continually refer to it as fruadband, but then expect an answer while doing so. I guess this tells a lot about ones character and ability to communicate. You do provide some entertainment value. 🙂

  4. @Hash Convicts/1453

    The cost to upgrade from FTTN to FTTP later on is about $20 billion.

    http://www.abc.net.au/technology/articles/2013/03/26/3723953.htm

    “The total node-to-premises distance is in the order of 7 million kilometres. If we apply the BT price of 1000 UK Pounds per 500 meters, or 2000 UK Pounds per kilometre (around $3000), the national upgrade has a maximum price of over $21 billion.”

    http://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2013/03/timico-cto-hit-by-slow-fttc-broadband-speeds-after-copper-corrosion.html

    “As it stands neither the UK government nor BT are willing the stump up the extra £15bn-£20bn that would be needed in order to make such a development possible. Indeed there are many arguments both for and against such an investment, especially one occurring at a time of economic austerity.”

    Anyway, I’ll leave the topic tonight.

  5. NBN plans compared

    Fixed line speeds 100mbps
    (1000mbps in future) 25-100mbps
    Satellite speeds 12mpbs-25mbps 12mpbs-25mbps
    Fibre to home 93% of premises 22% of premises
    Fibre to node 0% of premises 71% of premises
    Finished by 2021 2019
    Cost $44 billion $29.5 billion

    Read our explainer on the network differences

  6. Just to show that I enjoy our transactions Henry (no hard feelings), and you do provide me with a laugh, I went to find the post just for you. 🙂

    Hash Convicts
    Posted Wednesday, September 4, 2013 at 12:43 am | Permalink

    Henry

    Define #fraudband upload speed.
    Anyone?
    ——

    You do realize that upload speed also relies on distance to server and connection speed. For example (my simple friend 🙂 ) if you were on a 8 MB connection, I was on a 2 MB connection, we both had an upload speed of 100kb/s, and the server had was able to sustain 100kb/s (hypothetically of course), then we would both be uploading at 50/kb/s, now take that and apply it to what I have previously explained about both NBN’s and you may have a light globe moment. 😀
    —————-

  7. Hash Convicts@1453

    paaptsef

    Hash convicts you are advocating spending almost as much on upgrading 18th century technology as would be spent installing 21st century technology and what I am asking is where is the advantage in doing that?
    ——–

    I understand what you are saying. The thing is do we spend on what we believe to be the fastest technology now or upgrade a little to tie us over for a possibly better technology due to the pace of it continually growing. There are also the other factors to consider, like the ones i mentioned above (you can read them if you like). Money and those issue I raised are also very viable factors. For me personally, I believe the right direction is the upgrade, you might feel different.

    There is nothing faster than the speed of light dickea…er Harsh C.
    FFS get it right now!

  8. Hash, scientists have been experimenting and competing for a very long time now on the fastest method the transmit data over distance. With physicists now being able to transport photons instantaneously, do you really think that we are on the cusp of something better than glass fibre?

    Have we found anything superior to replace glass for windows? Have we found anything better to transmit electricity affordably than aluminum and copper?

  9. For the foreseeable future fibre is the tech of choice. Our local exchanges are connected by fibre. Our major trunk lines are fibre. Our intercontinental lines are fibre. There is a good reason for that. It is only a matter of time for all our homes to be connected by fibre. You can upgrade fibre by changing the stuff on the ends. Just like copper is upgraded now. It makes it harder to upgrade if there is a major interface in a box in the street rather than at the exchange with lots of power and air con and stuff like that or at the subscribers home.

  10. The next Coalition government will deliver fast broadband that’s affordable for all Australians.

    The Coalition’s plan to transform the NBN will see:

    · Download speeds of between 25 and 100 megabits per second by the end of 2016 and 50 to 100 megabits per second by 2019.

    · The rollout of the NBN under the Coalition will be complete by the end of 2019.

    · Regions with substandard internet services will receive priority rollout.

    · Basic broadband plans will always be more affordable under the Coalition than under Labor. Projections show that prices will be $24 cheaper a month by 2021 than under Labor’s NBN projected prices.

    · The Coalition’s NBN will cost tens of billions less to complete than Labor’s NBN.

    The Coalition’s plan will ensure the National Broadband Network is rolled out faster and cheaper, resulting in lower prices for consumers.

    Families and businesses will enjoy significant increases in bandwidth given that download rates in Australia currently average less than 5 megabits per second.

    Under the Coalition’s NBN all premises will have access to download speeds 25mbps to 100mbps by the end of 2016. The minimum speed will rise to 50mbps by the end of 2019 for 90 per cent of fixed line users.

    We will give highest priority to the suburbs, towns and regions with the poorest broadband services today.

    By contrast, Labor has failed to deliver any improvement in service to up to 2 million premises with poor broadband. Homes with a sub-standard service, new housing estates with no connection at all and the many multi-dwelling premises (such as apartment blocks) that have not been connected have little or no prospect of getting better broadband under Labor.

    The Coalition’s NBN will be affordable for consumers.

    From day one, average retail prices under a Coalition NBN won’t exceed prices for Labor’s NBN.

    Over time, rollout savings will mean the average household broadband plan for the Coalition’s NBN will be considerably more affordable than the same plan if Labor’s NBN proceeds.

    By 2021, the projected retail cost of the average broadband plan under a Coalition NBN would be $66 per month, compared to at least $90 per month with Labor’s NBN.

    Labor’s own modelling predicts that prices for household broadband plans will have to quadruple in the next few years if the NBN is ever to repay the borrowed money spent to build it. Such increases will leave the NBN out of reach for average Australian families.

  11. Hash Convicts@1454

    Henry

    Simple question Hash C.
    What is the coalitions upload speed on their #fraudband?
    Can you name it?
    ——
    Well Henry, I answered this a page back if you check. Although amusing, it is funny how you continually refer to it as fruadband, but then expect an answer while doing so. I guess this tells a lot about ones character and ability to communicate. You do provide some entertainment value.

    I missed that answer what was it?

  12. Henry

    There is nothing faster than the speed of light dickea…er Harsh C.
    FFS get it right now!
    ———-
    I posted about the variables in upload speeds above, you were warned by William about this approach, hopefully he will take care of it, although I don’t care personally, but it just shows your lack of respect for the rules of this forum.

  13. Hash@1453

    All the indications from, for example, Cisco and communications engineers (i.e., people actually qualified in the field) that FTTN will not do the job and will be out of date by the time it’s completed in ??? ten years?

    And depending on the addressing mode used it is in any case actually possible for a single server to sustain massively high bandwidth to thousands of clients. (Multicast addressing for example.) Also bear in mind that the old simple client server setup can be modified with clustered servers and a “single server” can be virtualised over multiple actual hardware servers. It’s only when considering the future in terms of yesterday’s technology that FTTN and the associated client server paradigm responding to manual user request (instead of multiple automated processes)seem relevant to discussions about future of communications.

  14. zoidlord
    Posted Wednesday, September 4, 2013 at 1:22 am | Permalink

    @Hash Convicts/1463

    Now I accuse you of reading from Coalition Party propaganda.
    ————

    Of course I posted it from there, I was going to post the link also but I got side tracked by another abusive comment from the ohh so classy and coolheaded Henry… LOL. Henry is good for Liberal business that’s for sure!

  15. Wow. copy and paste. That’s a good argument.
    Oh when it says minimum speed will rise to 50mbs, thats actually the minimum maximum speed. We will be offered up to 50mbs. Theoretically. Just like my ADSL2 that is up to 12mbs.

  16. David Mills

    All the indications from, for example, Cisco and communications engineers (i.e., people actually qualified in the field) that FTTN will not do the job and will be out of date by the time it’s completed in ??? ten years?

    Yes, and in that time we may see a faster technology to invest it. The analogy that ‘glass is still used’ or other references does not hold up. Computer technology is ever evolving, there for it will continue to move at a fast pace, this means that we want to leave the door open for the possibility to invest in even faster technology. That and the other factors I have mentioned.

  17. Hash Convicts@1467

    Henry

    There is nothing faster than the speed of light dickea…er Harsh C.
    FFS get it right now!
    ———-
    I posted about the variables in upload speeds above, you were warned by William about this approach, hopefully he will take care of it, although I don’t care personally, but it just shows your lack of respect for the rules of this forum.

    No Foo…

    Answer the question.
    Under #fraudband what is the minimum upload speed?
    Simple question

  18. Hash Convicts@1469

    zoidlord
    Posted Wednesday, September 4, 2013 at 1:22 am | Permalink

    @Hash Convicts/1463

    Now I accuse you of reading from Coalition Party propaganda.
    ————

    Of course I posted it from there, I was going to post the link also but I got side tracked by another abusive comment from the ohh so classy and coolheaded Henry… LOL. Henry is good for Liberal business that’s for sure!

    So you are a liberal stooge.
    Thank you, says it all.

  19. Roger Miller

    Wow. copy and paste. That’s a good argument.
    Oh when it says minimum speed will rise to 50mbs, thats actually the minimum maximum speed. We will be offered up to 50mbs. Theoretically. Just like my ADSL2 that is up to 12mbs.
    ———–

    I admitted to copy and pasting already so you missed that boat. If you look back some pages, Labor supporters have been copy pasting all night, and don’t even understand what they are copy pasting. I thought Id give myself a little break. 🙂

  20. You’re presenting Liberal propaganda which has $66 vs $90, yet the government says altogether it will cost $43B and the coalition says it will cost over $90B.

    If we worked on both sides being equally incredulous, I would say that in terms of price, they are much of a muchness. In terms of the quality of the product, I doubt you would be silly enough to claim both options are equal.

    Liberals (particularly Turnbull) want to create rent seeking opportunities for themselves at the expense of the taxpayer. I believe the average taxpayer will see through this and realise that they don’t require Liberal installed rent seekers gouging their hard earned.

  21. Hash Convicts@1467

    Henry

    There is nothing faster than the speed of light dickea…er Harsh C.
    FFS get it right now!
    ———-
    I posted about the variables in upload speeds above, you were warned by William about this approach, hopefully he will take care of it, although I don’t care personally, but it just shows your lack of respect for the rules of this forum.

    No it says i think you are a twit.

  22. @Hash Convicts/1469

    I get my information from the real world facts, not made up rubbish from Coalition Party Policy.

    OK?

    Here is another thing, Telstra copper has lots of little indifference. This is called Cable Attenuation, which effects the speed of what you get.

    Telstra Network has them ranging from:

    0.32mm
    to
    1.27mm

    0.40mm being most popular in urban area’s.

    This is why Coalition NBN will fail, is due to Telstra Copper.

    Type of Copper available is:

    PIUT Paper Insulated Unit Twin
    PIQL Paper Insulated Quad Local
    PIQJ Paper Insulated Quad Junction
    PIQC Paper Insulated Quad Carrier
    APIUT Aluminium Paper Insulated Unit Twin
    CPFUT Cellular Polyethylene Insulated Filled Unit Twin
    PEIUT Polyethelene Insulated Unit Twin
    CPIUT Cellular Polyethelene Insulated Unit Twin

    Now how do you think, FTTN type network will go, where there is such variance in the copper? Let alone in your own argument about the variance of download/upload speeds.

  23. 1000/400 Mbps*
    FTTP
    Fibre to the Premises
    Your house is connected to the internet via an optic fibre. The expected minimum lifetime of this fibre is 60 years. The NBN is completely passive, all that lies between your house and the exchange is strands of glass and optical prisms, no power or ongoing maintenance is required.

    Upgrading the speed of the NBN is simply a matter of replacing the equipment at each end of the fibre. Speeds exceeding 40,000 Mbps have already been demonstrated in research laboratories using the same type of fibre as in the NBN
    http://howfastisthenbn.com.au/

  24. 25/5 Mbps
    FTTN
    Fibre to the Node
    “We are absolutely confident that 25 megs is going to be enough, more than enough, for the average household” – Tony Abbott*

    Your house is connected to a NBN node via existing copper wire. Each of the planned 30,000 nodes is a self-contained mini telephone exchange. These nodes have complicated internals that require regular maintainance and a reliable power source.

    Your internet connection speed to the coalition’s NBN is dependent on the distance of your house to the nearest node, the quality of your existing telephone line, and the quality of your home’s internal copper wiring.
    http://howfastisthenbn.com.au/

  25. Henry

    No Foo…

    Answer the question.
    Under #fraudband what is the minimum upload speed?
    Simple question
    ———-

    So you know the upload speed of future ISP offers, the distance to every server from everyone’s connection? Nar you don’t do you, the only stooge here is the one who probably has no idea what upload is, nor what effects its connection. You really are a gold mine for Liberals Henry. Ill try and get more people over to interact, you are worth paying for. 😀

  26. @1471

    That’s rubbish. You are being all open minded about the potential of unobtainium to supercharge our Internet, yet you can’t fathom any significant potential or benefit in having leading edge technology assisting Australians to pioneer new frontiers that will not be possible with fraudband.

  27. Hash@1471

    Yes, and in that time we may see a faster technology to invest it. The analogy that ‘glass is still used’ or other references does not hold up. Computer technology is ever evolving, there for it will continue to move at a fast pace, this means that we want to leave the door open for the possibility to invest in even faster technology.

    Quantum networking possibly but I’d expect that to take about 50 years or so at least. Right now fibre tests and tests reliably at petabit speeds (look it up) and we can assume even faster speeds as the electronics at each end improves so fibre is hardly a risk for a technical speed dead end for many decades.

  28. zoidlord
    Posted Wednesday, September 4, 2013 at 1:32 am | Permalink

    @Hash Convicts/1469

    I get my information from the real world facts, not made up rubbish from Coalition Party Policy.
    ——-

    No, you are simply finding technical information to try and support Labors blown out NBN cost that will not achieve better speeds on a daily basis than the Liberals NBN. Yep, I copied and pasted that, and I said that I did, you on the other hand started talking about aspects of the NBN that you believe sound better, but in technical terms to the average person will no see one scrap of difference in the real world. You can copy paste every aspect of Labors NBN, I wont dispute the connections are better, however the speeds will not be on a daily use.

    You are not only unable to tell us one server that can sustain a output to 1000s of users at 100MB/sec, but your inability to know the difference between a peer to peer connection and server host is hilarious.

    However, you can copy paste till your blue in the face, you can copy every detail about the NBN from every bias NBN article you like but at the end of the day guess what?

    Liberal’s NBN will be used. Game over.

  29. <a href="Hash Convicts@1480

    Henry

    No Foo…

    Answer the question.
    Under #fraudband what is the minimum upload speed?
    Simple question
    ———-

    So you know the upload speed of future ISP offers, the distance to every server from everyone’s connection? Nar you don’t do you, the only stooge here is the one who probably has no idea what upload is, nor what effects its connection. You really are a gold mine for Liberals Henry. Ill try and get more people over to interact, you are worth paying for.

    “>Hash Convicts@1480

    Henry

    No Foo…

    Answer the question.
    Under #fraudband what is the minimum upload speed?
    Simple question
    ———-

    So you know the upload speed of future ISP offers, the distance to every server from everyone’s connection? Nar you don’t do you, the only stooge here is the one who probably has no idea what upload is, nor what effects its connection. You really are a gold mine for Liberals Henry. Ill try and get more people over to interact, you are worth paying for.

    Hash Convicts@1480

    Henry

    No Foo…

    Answer the question.
    Under #fraudband what is the minimum upload speed?
    Simple question
    ———-

    So you know the upload speed of future ISP offers, the distance to every server from everyone’s connection? Nar you don’t do you, the only stooge here is the one who probably has no idea what upload is, nor what effects its connection. You really are a gold mine for Liberals Henry. Ill try and get more people over to interact, you are worth paying for.

    Here’s a tip.
    It’s slow.
    Glacial slow.
    FTN all the way baby.

  30. So what happens to a node if lightening strikes nearby? A solar storm?

    We are talking about a network which is crucial to our way of life. This is not a luxury item.

    Do you know that spies are able to remotely detect electrical signals passing through metal data cables (including USB) just by using sophisticated detection equipment, even through walls?

    Works on the same principle as radio telescopes.

  31. @Hash Convicts/1484

    Plenty of people said that to me before “oh your just trying the technical fault with the policy”.

    Well duh, this is a technical policy, and if you not sound on technical issues, then the cost of the project will increase.

    Coalition Party are making promises without checking what’s under the hood.

  32. @Hash1484

    Liberal’s NBN will be used. Game over.

    All well and good. And the opportunity cost for Australia will be massive as the rest of the world runs with FTTP. That will be one of the LNP’s several economic blunders in the years to come if a certain Nobel prize winning economist’s opinion is anything to rely on. The point is Hash that all the experts I’ve read and heard in the field of comms (academics and engineers and comms companies like CISCO) are saying that FTTN won’t cut it.

  33. Radguy

    That’s rubbish. You are being all open minded about the potential of unobtainium to supercharge our Internet, yet you can’t fathom any significant potential or benefit in having leading edge technology assisting Australians to pioneer new frontiers that will not be possible with fraudband.
    ———-

    At what cost? What potential. Go ahead and show me one real world situation where Australians will be connected outside of this country at benefit that warrants a 17 billion dollar additional price tag when our country is in so much debt.

    Lets face it, how many people are using torrents/usenet/serverhosting here, and think that connecting within Australia will present an acceptable alternative to connecting to worldwide alternatives? None.

    Does anyone here know of any filehosting/torrent groups within Aus or outside that host servers that are capable of 100MB/sec speeds to 1000s of users? None

    What about seeing out our debt, investing in what is affordable now minus the Labor bias to drive up the price, then investing later when we can afford it.

    Nar, Labor supporters don’t want that. We want the fastest internet possible, we want it all now, we dont care about the debt because the Labor party says our debt is small.

    LOL it is no wonder Labor will be kicked out Saturday, and I’m proud to be one of the ones doing it.

    Night all! 😀

  34. @Hash Convicts/1492

    You keep claiming that but Liberals on policy states 25-100Mbps, same with Labor’s NBN 25-100Mbps.

    Your own blind faith is your own doing.

  35. zoidlord

    Of course the usual suspects just run away.
    ——
    Ahaha sorry I gotta respond to this last one. Some of us have to work, you can banter on about your NBN that people can see you have copy pasted all night, yep I copy pasted one thing, obviously as a joking reference to show that anyone can copy paste, hence why I admitted to this straight after it.

    The amusing this is that your one of these ‘ohh they’ve done a runner’ people. You have nothing to run away from, you have nothing to offer in the way of knowledge about the NBN other than to copy what others have posted from other sources which of course just happen to support your political agenda.

    They can also read your inability to differentiate the difference between peer to peer and server hosting (which is gold). You can continue to post what you like ZL, in 5 days it wont matter what you have to say about the NBN because the Liberal NBN will be on its way.

    Usual suspects? Im new on this forum, I guess you put as much thought into that as you did in explaining what servers can output to 1000s of people at a 100MB/sec.

    Ok now you can say “HC has done a runner”. Bhahahaha!

  36. @Hash Convicts/1496

    Well I wasn’t the one who was bantering… or copying or pasting.

    I do know the difference, and the one thing you keep forgetting that it’s not about what type of application it is, it’s the amount that is is used on your connection.

    When ADSL first came around it was getting rid of Dialup costs and having ‘always on’.

    Now it’s about bandwidth, and how many people will use your connection.

    Yes, run away from the argument, or continue to copy and paste from your liberal sites.

    ..run away, run away.

    And don’t use the excuse of working etc, that doesn’t work with me, other’s work as well, but we don’t run off to an argument that someone else started.

  37. Hash, I question your $17B figure outright. I also find it narrow minded for you to think that this figure won’t be paid back may times over through the course of the NBNs lifespan.

    We can afford it, you have to spend money to make money. If I hadn’t reinvested every skeric of cash into borrowing to advance my business, I would be competing with hacks in my industry. Instead, I offer a world class product.

  38. zoidlord/1477

    Telstra Network has them ranging from:

    0.32mm
    to
    1.27mm

    0.40mm being most popular in urban area’s.

    This is why Coalition NBN will fail, is due to Telstra Copper.

    Type of Copper available is:

    PIUT Paper Insulated Unit Twin
    PIQL Paper Insulated Quad Local
    PIQJ Paper Insulated Quad Junction
    PIQC Paper Insulated Quad Carrier
    APIUT Aluminium Paper Insulated Unit Twin
    CPFUT Cellular Polyethylene Insulated Filled Unit Twin
    PEIUT Polyethelene Insulated Unit Twin
    CPIUT Cellular Polyethelene Insulated Unit Twin
    ———-
    Yep that’s all you ROFL! From a guy that has no idea on the difference between peer to peer and server hosting. Perhaps save yourself the embarrassment and quit while your behind. Some people are just too irresistible to laugh at, making an example of you is worth losing sleep over.
    ———–
    I do know the difference, and the one thing you keep forgetting that it’s not about what type of application it is, it’s the amount that is is used on your connection.

    When ADSL first came around it was getting rid of Dialup costs and having ‘always on’.

    Now it’s about bandwidth, and how many people will use your connection.
    ———

    Clearly you have no idea, because if you did you would understand the simple concept that you cannot receive more than the capability of a servers output, hence me asking you the question that you failed miserably on about servers that can sustain 1000s of users at 100MB/sec.

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